“Inside the Lab” Podcast, a Discussion on Education in Second Life

Welcome to the latest “Inside the Lab” Podcast, a Discussion on Education in Second Life

I had the pleasure of talking with Pathfinder Linden and Claudia Linden about some of the fascinating education projects taking place in Second Life. These two expert Lindens share some of what they’ve learned working with educators inworld and at conferences, as well as from participation with some of the groups described in the podcast (see links, below.)

Torley’s image of Katt Linden, Claudia Linden and Pathfinder Linden
(dressed as a dragon,) at the suitably out-of-this-world
Ars Simulacra (SLurl), overlooking amazing art by Madcow Cosmos,
where we met to discuss education in Second Life.

“Inside the Lab” Podcast Series

This Discussion on Education in Second Life is fourth in the series of behind the scenes looks at Second Life, talks with a variety of Linden Lab team members about what they’re doing in Second Life and how their work could impact your experience.

The series began with Philip Linden’s Vision for Second Life in 2008, followed by a more technical talk, Joe Miller’s Insight into the Engineering Team at Linden Lab. Third in the series was Inside the Lab Podcast with the WindLight Team, packed with helpful information on WindLight, including information on stability improvements, and Torley’s favorite new WindLight features.

Please join us for an informal look into the people, projects, and culture at Linden Lab.

Discussion on Education in Second Life, What’s Going On and How To Get Involved
Listen in (or read the .pdf or text or html transcript) for Claudia and Pathfinder’s interesting – and helpful –perspectives on topics including:

  • Some of the cool educational projects going on in Second Life – and who is involved
  • The benefits – what is it that educators are finding so useful about Second Life
  • How you can get involved – both inworld and in your regular life
  • A look into the future of education in Second Life

I hope you’ll enjoy the discussion as much as we did! And do let us know what other topics you’d like to see us cover in future Inside the Lab podcasts.

Thanks Torley, Melissa, Pathfinder and Claudia!

And thanks to you for listening!

— Katt Linden

Podcast (mp3)
Text transcript (.pdf) (.doc) or (html)
Subscribe to RSS Feed
after 6/7/08 via iTunes

Second Life Education Resources

SLED Email List



Enjoy the whole Inside the Lab Podcast Series
Inside the Lab Podcast with Philip Rosedale (mp3)

Inside the Lab Podcast with Joe Miller (mp3)

Inside the Lab Podcast with the Windlight Team (mp3)

Inside the Lab Discussion on Education in Second Life (mp3)

Podcast with Pathfinder & Claudia Linden, in discussion with Katt Linden, produced by Melissa Linden, recorded and edited by Torley Linden, photography by Torley Linden

This entry was posted in Community, Creativity & Ideas, Podcast, Resident Experience. Bookmark the permalink.

128 Responses to “Inside the Lab” Podcast, a Discussion on Education in Second Life

  1. Sandor Balczo says:

    I take that back. It works now. You may remove my previous comment and this one to allow other people to express their views :).

    Sandor 🙂

  2. Katt Linden says:

    Thanks, Sandor! I hope you enjoy the podcast!

    — Katt

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  5. Since I’m not english mother tongue, I couldn’t enjoy this discussion if you didn’t provide a transcript.

    I really appreciate you publish both the podcast and the transcript at the same time. Thanks!

  6. Pingback: Second Life Podcast: Shape of Things to Come? « Common.Sensible

  7. Wow; 40 % of these posts are to blog links; sad….

    On topic…

    Second Life has the ability to be a wonderful tool one day, and education will be a paramount part of its structure.

  8. The rss subscription link gives me Torley’s tutorials and quicktips but not the podcast referred to in this blog post. Nearly everything is video – the most recent audio program is the windlight team one from April 5.

    Looking forward to listening to this episode on education. Hopefully the feed will update itself in due course.

    This certainly looks like a fascinating topic. Thanks for making it available.

  9. Pingback: Linden Lab release 4th podcast: education and Second Life : The Metaverse Journal - Australia’s Virtual World News Service

  10. Gil Druart says:

    .. continuing my valiant but doomed counter-attack against the prevalent paucity of proof-reading (shame on you, Katt) … what, precisely, is an “expert Linden”?

    Well, an expert pianist is someone who can play the piano very well, so presumably an expert Linden is someone who’s …. ummmm .. very good at … ummmm … being a Linden?

    If I were feeling in the mood for deviltry, my next step would be to invite community suggestions as to what qualities that might imply 😉

  11. Drew says:

    These are pretty great way to keep us in the loop on whats going on. Something short, weekly (less than 10 minutes) from each studio head or something would be pretty excellent, even if wasn’t ‘official’ company stuff. Whats going on on the various projects is near impossible to keep track of from anyone without an inside view. Surely they could spend 1/2 hour a week or every other week talking about whats going on in their area of development.

    Anywho, just 2 cents on how to quell the masses.

  12. Christos Atlantis says:

    Great information here for both the knowledge seekers and providers, and very well put together Katt I knew you could purr. 😛

  13. Burgess Miles says:

    where is the actual place where you can air your frustration on SL functionality nowadays? I mean there’s no comments on the grid ststus reports that I know of….my SL experience have gradually become less and less enjoyable with every new server update and whatnot. my comp is fairly new, less than one yr old, and state of the art but my SL experience have become laggier and laggier, movements more and more jerky, more and more truoble moving, rezzing and doing transactions….what is actually happening, could someone please explain?

  14. Burgess Miles says:

    …I mean, these last few days, even flying have become difficult…

  15. Richard Halden says:

    @ Burgess Miles
    Well you don’t get it yet. That was the hidden goal of Linden all along.
    Hush the crowd so we look good. I have a few other words for it but this is not a democracy and I do not want to die.

    And on the hard flying. Everybody with a not brand new machine can’t hardly fly anymore. The sinking bug was patched with a sort of air-brake and now it takes at least a full second before you get moving again after every stop. We just don’t see this kind of things anymore because Linden succeeded in hushing the critics and ofcourse no normal person understands Jira. Nothing we can do about it then be humble and pray for a compettitor.

  16. Hodgey Hogfather says:

    Burgess…NP. Just set all your preference sliders to the left, set draw distance less than 100, remove shiney, clouds, most of the water stuff, shut off local lighting, etc, etc. Then you will have snappy performance just like before, and as a real plus, if you are on the mainland, most of those irritating rotating signs won’t show up in your view any more. Oh yes, you are right, it won’t look as good as the good old days when you could set the draw distance at over 300, but hey, we can’t have everything….. 😛

  17. Katt Linden says:

    @7 Obscure, There is a transcript, I’m sorry you had trouble finding the link! Here it is for you:


    @11 Gil, Expert Linden? Well, Pathfinder and Claudia are experts, just listen to the podcast and you’ll see!

    @12 Drew, thanks! We do intend to make shorter podcasts, but this one was so packed with information and so fun to make it is longer. What topics would you like to hear more about, in a little more detail than we usually go into on the blog?

  18. RichD says:

    Very interesting podcast…. Unfortunately based on Katt’s lack of response the 800lbm gorilla in the room is being ignored again..

  19. Burgess Miles says:

    but it surely can’t be in anyones interest that we aren’t able to fly? can it?? surely not!? I mean it’s pretty basic stuff…surely they’ll make us being able to fly again?

  20. Aaron J. Freeman says:

    I’m surprised there’s still room to post, without the Off-Topic Flooding of the other Blog Entries. Katt must be moderating, with malice aforthought. I’d like to take this moment, to Spam in favor of Mystic Academy, which is quite friendly, to those who’d like practice teaching. Most try to teach in mystical subjects, but the magic of Teaching is a mystery in its own right, and the foundation of the big three western religions: Judaism; Islam; Catholicism; Protestantism; Socialism; Buddhism and Stand Up Comedy. Well, teaching is one mystery, and the Mysteries of Mathematics came after. Staff meeting at 2:30 PM, Monday, at Spirit City, for those interested in Teaching.
    I’m really interested in how to use this medium for real teaching, as with the Ring of Solomon, but the most intense I can find, are the Quaker Services, where Crashing is ritually accepted, as part of the experience. The Dance_Through_Perdition rituals will have to be taken a little more cautiously.
    I think Sims might have some potential as Books, but most of our books are ultimately Dance, and Simulations are more Graffitesque, as of Cave Walls. Cave Walls used to have Spiritual Teachings, as of Rainbows, and Technical Writings, as of how to Atlatl a Mastodon.
    They might also be good for administrative blue-printing; is there an admin blueprint, of Linden Research Labs, done as an Island?

    Arawn Spitteler

  21. Ky Aska says:

    Burgess, No-Fly is an option on the land, not a world-wide setting. I can think of several uses: An art exhibit, for example, might not want you to look at things from angles other than from the ground. A maze would be ruined if you could just fly over it. Certain RPs are broken by flight – there have been modified clients, or at least keybindings, to turn it off in the past for just that reason. It’s just annoying when it’s set for no reason.

    No-Fly is client-side, though. You can override it by displaying the admin menu. It’s one of the last few options on the Advanced menu – Torley’s posted about how to get there in the past. (Don’t request admin status or try using the admin options, though. I have a feeling that some Linden or set there of gets a message each time a normal resident tries, and that would get annoying after a while)

  22. Lilly says:

    Logins are down!

  23. DISGUSTED IN LINDEN LABS™® *!@$!! says:

    how about updating the blog about the failing inworld features grrrrrrr when will you all ever get this straightened out its just the worst run company i have ever seen just makes me sick why is it you can not give us some kind of answer or time frame that will tell us when these failures will be FIXED its been bloody months already

  24. Drew says:


    More regular updates on things that are “in the pipe”.
    For example, some dialog behind the decisions or features that are slated or in development.

    Hard to suggest things as I don’t even know. With the exception of the mono project, (havok4 being the last well publicized project) what else is coming? The next RC has radical changes to the interface yet minimal discussion on what/why/where things have changed.

    Any info thats provided about things going on @ Linden Lab will prove well received as it makes less, ‘angry at things not working’ and more, oh, thats why, hmm that is a tricky problem to solve.

    The server upgrades I think would be a particular sore spot as many notifications come only days before and the details on what has been changed are often painfully skimp.

    Last thing that just hit me. Lots of Linden’s have office hours. Lots of Linden’s keep a Log of those office hours. Much info is given out that only those who attend find out about. Maybe a weekly post linking to office hour logs with the major topic or theme of the conversation. I assume its all on the wiki just a matter of either the linden or someone skimming and putting a title on it?

    More ideas if/when they form 😉

  25. dana vanmoer says:

    Posted by Status Desk on June 2nd, 2008 at 10:56 am PDT
    We’re arranging some partial outages wednesday and thursday AM for inventory database rotations. Groups of residents will be affected at different times, from 6.30 to 8.00 a.m. on Tuesday and Thursday, but affected residents will only be affected for a period of 15 minutes, during which they’ll be unable to log in.

    UMMMM how about the down for emergency maintenance announcement that affects us NOW not the stuff that might affect us in 2 days time – how stupid is this?
    I’m sorry to post off topic but there is no-where else to ask.
    I get told to check the grid status report i refresh to find that message and nothing about not being able to log in right now????
    communivcations officer should maybe concentrate on actually communicating the problems instead of podcasts that are useless if no-one can get in world

  26. dana vanmoer says:

    oh apologies they posted it 4 minutes later – 20 minutes after i tried to log in

  27. Katt Linden says:

    @27 Well Dana, I’m sorry you’re so frustrated. I didn’t have any trouble logging in just now myself.

    Lots of folks seem to appreciate early warning of outages, when we’re able to provide them. If you don’t want to see them, you can just go ahead and try to login to Second Life, because now the login screen of the viewer will show (in the top right corner) if status is Online or not, as well as summarize the last few Status Reports.

    I hope that helps!
    – Katt

  28. Katt Linden says:

    @26 Drew, nice ideas, thanks!

  29. dana vanmoer says:

    sorry you feel like that katt but obviously it often says online in the top corner when the grid is down for emergency maintenance, yes i have now logged in but it is very frustrating when the log in screen tells you to see the grid status page and that then says nothing AND the log in screen says online:

    One previous time this happened.

    Warning of outages is always appreciated but surely the fact logins are closed are more immediate? that was my question not the post itself.

  30. Gavin Hird says:

    Very concrete and direct question to Katt Linden:

    Why is it that messages of ongoing in-world problems are not announced in-world? As communications manager, this is one serious issue you need to fix.
    You cannot expect people to hang on to the blog all the time for status messages.


  31. Argent Stonecutter says:

    Thanks for the transcript, and might I make a suggestion for one wee further enhancement… it might be easier for some folks to read in HTML or even plain text.

  32. Cinco Pizzicato says:

    I haven’t listened to the podcasts yet, but will.

    The thing is… I have a relatively new computer, and I can’t get around very well because LL doesn’t want to support it. This is relevant to this discussion because educational users of SL might very well be using older (or newer, unsupported) hardware. They’ll be left out of the educational arena, by virtue of not having a super-hot gaming system.

    If SL can be used for these education purposes, it should. But not addressing the high bar for entry makes it difficult to take any of these discussions seriously. I say this having not heard the podcasts, so perhaps they’re being addressed there, but somehow I doubt it.

  33. Cinco Pizzicato says:

    Also: Could you list these podcasts in iTunes? Torley knows how. 🙂 It would help streamline the your-server-to-my-ears process….

  34. pantaiputih korobase says:

    OT, just a general comment: hey Katt, thought you were on vacancy the last two weeks, we did not hear much from you for a while. Hope you followed the recent blogs and observed that less and less people interact, i.e. share their opinion in the blogs. Also hope that this does not indicate that residents are becoming more and more tired to involve themselves into the discussions and into the future development of SL. If so, this would be a poor indication, it could show that people are beginngin to loose their enthusiasm for that game.
    One good thing I realized is that we have the grid status news and the blog news on the login page again. who ever listened to us and changed this, thanks!
    don’t need to talk about the other basic problems SL has, everyone knows, did not change yet and still no vision or short term, mid term, long term plan to be disclosed to us. so: still lack of communication in some way.

    ON topic: it could facilitate the commuinication if you would summarize the ‘fascinating education projects’ in your blog post instead of simply adding links to here and there where we can get further info. such a summary would have been nice to get a quick look/impression of these projects instead of having to click all these links to find out what it is really about and if it is interesting for oneself. may be it is only me, but I often harldy understand what Lindens talk about in their blog posts at all and what they want to express concretely. ok, I understand Torley quite well 🙂

  35. Katt Linden says:

    #35 Cinco,

    The podcast will be in iTunes. According to Torley, it takes a couple of days to show up there. The others should be on iTunes already, at http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?id=151557204

  36. Aeper Jie says:

    So..Does this mean the Teen Grid..is going to finaly become a All Teen Grid? Right now..The Adults *Anyone over 18* Own Most of The grid.*not includeing LL Mainland sims.*

    But anyways Cool.

  37. Pingback: A little news from SecondLife « I’m Just an Avatar

  38. eku Zhong says:

    How about a podcast of a meeting about the database……
    you know you guys shooting the breeze on how you plan to fix it, z(or not) and why you insist on using MySQL and how you justify not changing over to something more suited like Opera?

  39. Soul Fortas says:

    just smiles

  40. Argent Stonecutter says:

    eku@40: Opera? Do you mean Oracle? That would be kind of expensive. I’d suggest PostgreSQL, myself. 🙂

  41. Pingback: MixedRealities :: Education in Second Life: a quiet but profound revolution

  42. RichD says:

    Katt, I didn’t see anywhere what your office hours are. I would think that as communications person… you would have some time set aside to communicate with us… If I missed the link I’m sure there are alot of us that would love to have you post it so we can come down and chat.

  43. Alvi Halderman says:

    Amazing Way To Talk Phil…….

  44. Burgess Miles says:

    #23 …I am – of course – not talking about inability to fly where flying is prohibited, Flying, where allowed, have become nearly impossible….and, I am also grateful that moderating here isn’t that strict since there aren’t any other channels for this kind of letting off frustrated steam-blogging since the SL status have been moved to a npn commentable place….

  45. hmm.. says:

    status said log-ins are resolved…. but i’ve been having failed log-ins since yesterday =/

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  47. Argent Stonecutter says:

    Flying isn’t impossible, but it’s frustrating. The code to stop the downward drift in Havok4 locks you into place randomly for seconds at a time.

  48. Ryu Darragh says:

    #4 Nomoresecrets, showing YouTube videos in SL depends on both the SL setup. You have to be able to play QuickTime videos before you can show YouTube videos.

    It also depends on the YouTube video having available the fmt=18 available in the URL. This is the MP4 feature, which is a QuickTime video format.

    As I understand it, you add “&t=SIGNATURE&fmt=18” to the URL to access the MP4 version of the video *IF* it has been saved that way.

    Otherwise, YouTube videos are FLV format and can’t be played within SL.

  49. Ryu Darragh says:

    Scripts need updating, I think, Argent. My cleaned up flight assist is *too* clean. Almost roboticly smooth. Thinking of adding some bobble to the averaging function before mono gets here 😛

  50. Peter Quirk says:

    The links in the transcript do not work. Any chance we could get an HTML version? I’m interested in the IBM Video.

  51. Katt Linden says:

    @52 Hi Peter,

    Here are the two IBM links…

    — Katt

  52. Katt Linden says:

    @33 Argent, @52 Peter, thanks for the suggestions.

    I’ve added the text version of the transcript (.doc) and also an html version, linked in the post above, to the .pdf.

    Hope that helps!

    — Katt

  53. Sean Heying says:

    Are you ever going to live up to your promise Katt and allow comments on the split away fault’s blog?

  54. Closed My Account Today says:

    3 cheers – no no – 6 cheers for Katt Linden !!!!

    Congratulations on silencing 99% of the residents!!!

    Enrollment must be way up when nobody sees all the downfalls and failures occurring !

    Must be way up cause performance, database issues, transactions still continue to be BORKED daily.

    Must be way up cause they do not know all the people quitting and all the content creators YOU ran out of business !!!

    Keep up the great work Katt – somebody you won’t need comments because nobody will actually care about your software!!

  55. Pingback: Podcast Educacion « Pulsar Project

  56. richard says:

    why is flying all screw up?

  57. Shadoe Landman says:

    @21, 49 So, it’s not just me. Over the past few days It’s been nearly impossible for me to fly. I thought something was wrong with my computer.

    Lindens, thank you for the mp3’s. I hope there are more in the future. Maybe a little shorter, though.

  58. Wyald Woolley says:

    Remember folks: One thing fixed, means two other things need to get broken. Flying got hit most recently, but hey, check out the pretty water!

  59. Burgess Miles says:

    never mind podcasts or whatever, just fix it so we can fly again please! a very very basic feature that have become nearly impossible. just fix it!!!

  60. golrolt says:


  61. Pepper Haas says:

    Eversince the asset problems started, I have lost jewelry items. All the copies I have of the jewelry (bracelet, earring) when I click wear, says, object not found in database. This happens even to items I have stored in prims in world, even with copies I gave to my alt. Every copy I have of the item is now “not found in database.”
    Education in SL? A year ago, I made a recommendation to my University to start up classes here, but now that group IM is wrecked, transactions fail all the time, inventory items disappear without a trace, too many shinies are added for the regular student’s laptop to keep up — so I’m not recommending anything. My SL experience is getting worse and worse, especially since they change the GUI all the time instead of actually fixing REAL problems. It’s really ugly and sad to see SL destroy itself like this.

  62. CPU: Intel(R) Pentium(R) Dual CPU E2140 @ 1.60GHz
    Memory: 2027 MB
    OS Version: Linux 2.6.22-3-686 #1 SMP Sun Feb 10 20:20:49 UTC 2008 i686
    Graphics Card Vendor: NVIDIA Corporation
    Graphics Card: GeForce 8500 GT/PCI/SSE2
    OpenGL Version: 2.1.2 NVIDIA 173.14.05

    For me, I resolved the continuous hassle with flying and moving about by de-activating the atmospheric shaders and water reflections. Bloody shame, ‘coz I finally got a graphics adapter which is capable of ‘showing it all’, but these settings render me in-world incapable of movement.. 😐

    Maybe others could try to and confirm wether that resolves the annoyance of being inable to go where your cursors should direct you to ?

    Also found that of late keyboard presses get ‘stuck’ or get irresponsive after a while, which requires me to minimize and restore the application window all the time or just simply quit.

    Residents incapable of movement might still join an exodus that is swifter than you can say ‘We quit with all this ****!’ … :S

  63. Verdana Klaar says:

    @56 : Katt is absolutely NOT responsible for issues that may occurr. Why don’t you address your bitter comment at the attention of LL’s Exec. Mgmt (or to Mr Prolific – the CEO watchdog who is sooooooooooo lovely with us all – and useless too). hm ?

    Btw, off-topic – am a bit comforted to notice that others can’t fly easily as well… I thought i was punished by posting some comments here 😀

  64. notcatcotton says:

    “The series began with Philip Linden’s Vision for Second Life in 2008”

    Color me confused I thought Philip was no longer CEO and has taken more to the creative side of SL these days. Why would his opinion have any bearing on what the NEW CEO does. I think we should maybe focus on what the CURRENT CEO has in mind for the future of SL.

  65. Vivienne says:

    Education in SL????


    Tell me the name of ONE educational or public organisation which is willing to invest xxx Dollars into the latest and greates of computing including 8xxx and 9xxx Nvidia cards every other year, only to enablle students to MOVE with an acceptable framerate in Second Life and being able to enjoy the SUNSET in windlighted skies. Muaaahhhh.

    /me rolls on the floor laughing.

  66. Tristin Mikazuki says:

    Looks like they are doing a rolling restart again and didnt post it to the blogs

    Server Version 1.22.3 Pilot Deploy to ~160 regions
    Posted by ReleaseTeam on June 3rd, 2008 at 05:26 am PDT
    Over the next hour, 160 regions will be restarted as we perform a pilot deploy of server version 1.22.3. More information about a rolling restart for a server deploy this week will be posted as it becomes available.

  67. Sean Heying says:

    @6 verdana “Katt is absolutely NOT responsible for issues that may occurr. ”

    Katt is not only not responsible she doesn’t follow up on her promises.

    She promised she would ask around about DMCA and get back to us… she never did.

    She promised she would enable comments on the Split away status blog, she never did.

    She never did answer why she had the same Identicon as Dusty Linden (AKA Katt and Dusty are the same person)

    But now, we have a new server refresh coming out without a blog here describing what it fixes, flying in particular I hope.

  68. Verdana Klaar says:

    @70 Go ask ToYleY – he will make a shiny answer in another vidtut.

  69. isitcatcotton says:

    I took the time to listen to all the pod casts. Some of the material is old news some seems a tad out of touch. Thanks Philip at least you did mention us artists who are still hanging in there, I do appreciate that. I didn’t like how Pathfinder and others made it clear that it’s “who you know” even in rl that kind of talk makes me leery. Hard work and ethics should get ppl ahead in life not just because they know someone who knows someone. Sorry but I work hard and play hard and I teach my grown kids to earn a living. I don’t mind paying my dues I just don’t like hearing that some jerk got ahead because they were in good with a Linden. I don’t care if it was based on Edu. or Org. Or .com. Anyways all in all I liked what I heard and although I am not as watermellony lovefest over windlight like Torley it does look nice. I hope LL does stay true to their word and we do see a vast improvement on stability hopefully by the end of the 2nd quarter. I understand more fully the direction they wish to take SL and I do hope they are able to do so.


  70. Vivienne says:

    @ 72

    Education does not need Windlight or any other wonderful graphics improvement, if these “improvements” slow down an average educational or business system towards unusability – as they do right now. IF Linden Lab really wants to attract the educational and business sectors, they must rethink their release politics. Stability first. And no more shiny, but uselss graphical hardware killers.

  71. Feldspar Millgrove says:

    There doesn’t seem to be any mention of it on the blog, but Flying is broken. (There is a JIRA about it.) If you press FLY, you will hover in the air, but none of the arrow keys work and you cannot move at all or do anything except press STOP FLYING. This seems to have broken sometime in the last few days.

    Also, I can’t update my Profile – it just loses the changes.

    Also, I can’t upload snapshots – says it’s having a problem and gives me a hexadcimal error code and to try later.

    Also, when you try to access some Library items (such as newbie clothing), you get a “Not in the database” error. I have also started seeing these on items from my personal Inventory. This has been going on for about 3 weeks.

    There is no mention of any of these problems on the blog or on the grid status page, yet they seem widely known when I ask other residents; the problems are not new and are not transient. Apparently Linden Lab does not want transparency on these ongoing current problems? I guess they figure if people are logged into the grid on their Concurrency graphs that’s sufficient.

  72. The RSS feed for the podcast does have the Torley videos, but not this podcast mentioned here. Yes, they take time to appear in the list of available podcasts in the itunes store but they should NOT take time to immediately be discovered and downloaded by a subscription to that podcast in iTunes. In this case, it’s not, which to me is representative of a feed issue and not an iTunes store episode listing issue.

    I also think that splitting out the audio podcasts about LL into their own feed would make more sense. Torley’s videos are too good and useful to share the limelight anyway, IMO. These really are two separate things and the only reason I can see to have them in the same feed is no one’s thought to create a new one.

  73. isitcatcotton says:

    @73 Yes stability is key. Might I suggest several viewers based on system specs. I think a very basic viewer is needed to reach the masses but more so; for the masses to be able to view SL with some stability.


  74. Kandy Tomorrow says:

    Katt, did you have a former job as a Presidential Press Secretary? You seem to be very adept in taking some little thing and making a big positive about it, while pretending problems people care about aren’t really there.

    Thanks for the podcast though! It’ll give me something to do while waiting for rezzes to fail, transactions to fail, tp’s to fail, logins to fail, etc.

  75. Verdana Klaar says:

    Off topic, but anyway :

    Am not often complaining about technical issues that may happen (ref: my posts here on the blog), still since recent date;

    – flying is something like erratic (not important as such)
    – uploading textures “may” sometimes work (oky, that is only 50 to 70L$, so can be acceptable per se once a while)
    – avatar is stuck on “demand” (lol) without any ability to move (fine, just close the viewer and restart, it “can” work fine again)
    – duplication of prims for faster builds throws the copied items some random meters away (ok no problem, we can readjust it)
    – large “holed” prims that were not “hollow” are now plains holes (a bit more concerning)
    – the usual msgs “object already pending” or “cannot rezz xyz” that were happening at time now seem to become like a recurrent mysterious displeasure of H4 or something else.
    – i also like the microsoft alike notice such as (appprox. quote) ” the operation was cancelled because the follwing error occured :::: an error occured ” – looks like Windows 95 “keyboard not found, press F1 to continue”

    Well, well well… all that be beared , provided some patience is involved. What can’t be is :

    – repeated “you cannot access Second Life from this computer “. why does this happen remains a total mystery, all the more than my alt can always.

    – and the most delicious for the end : ” If we are unable to collect the amount due within seven (7) days, your account will be suspended pending payment for an additional thirty (30) days. During that time, you will not be able to log in to Second Life. Failure to resolve this billing issue by the end of the probation period may result in the cancellation of your account.” – Which is – hm… how to say – totally false. Funny no ?

    Mr Toylific, can you make a vid-thing of all that for the sake of my own pleasure.

  76. Ravanne Sullivan says:

    According to the status page the grid is being updated to 1.22.3, yet no blog entry to give us any details of what is in 1.22.3. The last entry on 1.22 is no longer valid as they have had to make a number of changes to it yet we are kept in the dark as usual.

    Wouldn’t it be nice if LL®™ were to hire a communications Linden, someone who’s job it was to facilitate communications between LL®™ and their customers.

  77. Missy H says:

    Please answer our question about the DMCA, Katt. Please don’t break your promise.

  78. Solomon Devoix says:

    Verdana Klaar Says:
    @56 : Katt is absolutely NOT responsible for issues that may occurr. Why don’t you address your bitter comment at the attention of LL’s Exec. Mgmt (or to Mr Prolific – the CEO watchdog who is sooooooooooo lovely with us all – and useless too). hm ?


  79. Pingback: Katt and Dusty are the same person? - SLUniverse Forums

  80. Katt Linden says:

    @82 Solomon, actually, I’m here paying attention, even when I’m not able to solve the issues you’d like solved, as quickly as you’d prefer.

    I know that many of you have questions and issues you would like to see addressed, and I’m not ignoring that at all. I hope and expect that, over time, you will see things you’ll be happier about, both in stability inworld and with communications.

    @76 Verdana and others, I am taking note of your questions and concerns. I can’t promise what will happen, but I’m here to pay attention and help make sure that we know what issues are most pressing for you all. I hope you’ll feel that you see things addressed, over some time.

    @77 Kandy, no former WH press secretary work. I can’t actually answer every question that comes up, to my regret, but I am working to get more questions answered over time, in ways that get information out to everyone. At least that’s my goal.

  81. Katt Linden says:

    @72 isitcatcotton

    I’m glad you listened to all the podcasts! It’s not surprising that some of what Philip said seems familiar to you now, since it was recorded months ago, but I hope you enjoyed it.

    When folks get into Second Life, how much fun they have and how long they stay can be influenced by meeting someone — it’s not about “who” you know, it’s about the fact that as you do get to know others, it can be easier and more fun, and that’s a great way to learn and do projects as well.

    — Katt

  82. Katt Linden says:

    @ 70 Sean

    “Katt is not only not responsible she doesn’t follow up on her promises.
    – She promised she would ask around about DMCA and get back to us… she never did.
    – She promised she would enable comments on the Split away status blog, she never did.
    – She never did answer why she had the same Identicon as Dusty Linden (AKA Katt and Dusty are the same persoon.”

    Hey Sean! I’m so glad that you’re still here caring so passionately.

    Let’s see…Dusty and I are NOT the same person, I can say for sure! She’s inworld a great deal working, and so I posted for her, her words, her post, my computer. Sorry it confused you!

    Comments on the SL Grid Status Reports — you’ll see the link to the reports, and the last few reports, at the top left of this page, and also on the login screen now when you log into Second Life. I’m still working on comments, and if it seems to you that should have been easy and fast — it’s not, but it will happen, one way or another.

    DMCA, what’s your question?

    — Katt

  83. Curtis Dresler says:

    Well, the thread changed quickly, as it often does. As someone noted, there is little real outlets for comment in SL.

    PC-based networks have had the ability to post autowarnings for shutdowns since early Novell. Sometimes we still get them (but much rarer than a year ago), so I know your networks support them (btw, I am on mainland, so its LL). To be frozen in the middle of a process that threatens a loss of inventory, after being on-line for a good while due to a routine reboot is absolutely inexcusable. I repeat – absolutely inexcusable. This is a case of techs sitting on their hands and ignoring the customers. Yeah, yeah, we know – if we lost anything, we can always buy more Lindens and repurchase the item.

    Sometimes – sometimes – crashes or problems are explained on the log-in screen. This is an easy, one minute conduit to communicate to tens of thousans of users what is wrong, albeit maybe with only partial information. Too often, way too often, no one takes the time to make the effort or the lasty comment is a post that everything is fixed when it isn’t. As someone that has sat in front of a zero ring failure at two in the morning with one hand reaching for the phone to start the four hour response process, I know about priorities. But at some point, the techs at LL need to realize – we are users, we ARE the priority, and you are losing us from simple signs of indifference.

    I, for one, am not talking about expending resources to solve a technical issue. I am talking about your staff taking one minute here and there to do what every other tech staff is expected to do, and that is communicate with the end users. Not just when they feel like it, but every time. 100 %, ten minutes before when possible, but the minute after if not.

    We pay the bills. We are leaving, some completely, but others, like me, assessing what I can afford to lose and cutting back to that. Maybe there are things that can’t be easily solved, but a lack of courtesy to the people logging on at five in the morning, the people that help pay the bills, is easily solved – even if it means showing some people to the door.

  84. Interested Citizen says:

    how come the identicons mysteriously disappear once the finger that katt and dusty are the same person was trotted out?

  85. Ravanne Sullivan says:

    84 Katt Linden Says:
    I’m here paying attention, even when I’m not able to solve the issues you’d like solved, as quickly as you’d prefer.

    Nothing will frustrate and anger customers than a lack of real communications whether that lack is real or perceived. I have worked a a project manager and all the stakeholders on any project I was working on received regular updates on the status of their project even if that update amounted to nothing more than telling them that nothing had changed since the last update. Be keeping them all in the loop and letting them know that I had not forgotten them things went much smoother and even when the news was not good they were happy that they were not kept in the dark.

    If you are aware of issues and working on them, even if nothing can be done at this time you need to let us know. Considering the nature of SL®™ not a day should go by without at least a message to say that you are still with us and working to make SL¯™ a better place.

    Communications is vital, both to keep your customers happy and to let your technical staff know of issues before they turn in to major problems. Talk to us, listen to us and give us the tools to communicate. Having to post off topic comments in the blog because we have no other place to get our voices heard is not good for anyone.

  86. pantaiputih korobase says:

    signed, ravanne!

  87. Urantia Jewell says:

    Why is it that the Status Reports page says it deployed server version 1.22.(3) to ~160 regions — when the Planned Outage Calendar says that the rolling restarts for Wed & Thu will deploy server version 1.22.(2)?


  88. Katt Linden says:


    Wow, Interested, that’s funny. The identicons were a new feature enabled by Word Press, I assume that our web folks turned them off, I don’t know why.

    Do you all want the identicons back?

    — Katt

  89. pantaiputih korobase says:

    – some want identicons back
    – some want stability back
    – some want cam moving back normally
    – some want reliable TPs back
    – some want flying back
    – some want their missing data base items back
    – some want all animations to stop when all animations stop is selected
    – some want items purchased to be delivered
    – some want rezzing faster
    – some want to have birthday every day
    – some want even more
    – some want a short term, a mid term and a long term plan from LL
    p.s. forgive me my typos and I love SL of course

  90. Katt Linden says:

    @90 Urantia

    You asked about the deploy of different server versions.

    We did a 1.22.2 release last night to get data on a change, but it won’t go out broadly. (this is research.)

    The 1.22.3 release will have some physics-related changes added in, and is expected to go broadly.

    This is somewhat unusual. In the past we might not have even told Residents about the 1.22.2 test, but we’re trying to communicate more.

    — Katt

  91. Curtis Dresler says:

    Great. I was on SL, left to take care of the Scotties, and when I came back I was told the computer that has been running SL for an hour or more (and is connected here), that “Second Life can’t be accessed from here”. Of course there is no problems reported on THAT blog. And half an hour later I am writing this and hanging it up for the night.

    If it happens tomorrow, I’ll give up after four or five tries. And at some point, I put up the last 8K for sale and move on entirely. If this continues – and LL seems to have no interest in ending the daily crap of this type – I will be one more of the dearly departed. I’ll do my two cents worth of screwing the remaining people when I dump my property at 70-75% of what I paid, pulling that market down even further. Better to lose $ 50 – 75 now than $ 250 – 300 later.

    Yeah, I think that I’m going to make July 4th my personal Independence Day. This is so, so old and the Neros fiddle while Rome burns. (You really need a Nero Linden) Get more from petting the Scotties and letting them snore in my lap…

  92. Syzygy Merlin says:

    Education in Second Life? Well, I just learned that I am not the only one who has been rendered incapable of flying in the past week or so…

  93. Missy H says:

    Thank you for the reply, Katt.

    A while ago in the blog I asked why are DMCAs filed for the removal of UUIDS of stolen textures ignored? You were very helpfull and said because you didn’t know the answer, you would ask it for us to the lindens.

  94. Zi Ree says:

    @92 Katt Linden: Yes, turning the identify icons back on would be great.

    Communication is really really important. Ans yes, even if there is nothing to communicate. “Hi guys! You’re waiting for an answer on XY. I don’t have news yet, but the issue is still in work.” goes a long way. Two years ago we had this problem with the Linux viewer being neglected, and back then we requested to have the Changelogs say: “No Linux specific changes” when there were none. This gave us at least a hint that you weren’t forgetting about the Linux folks and that we didn’t have to look for changes that might have happened.

    So … communicate more, follow up on open questions, do status updates. 🙂

  95. Burgess Miles says:

    …just fix flying, PLEASE!!!…and a lot of other things of course…but I mean, how basic is flying? Will we not be able to walk next? Education in this enviroment? Selling this idea to big companies? Sure….good luck…

  96. Argent Stonecutter says:

    Quick Question… when will we see release notes for server 1.22.3?

  97. Tristin Mikazuki says:

    Is there info out on the 1.22.2 release thats going on today? or a blog entry?

  98. Ravanne Sullivan says:

    A quick glance over the status page and you will see a pattern developing. A pattern of repeated failures of things that should be under the control of LL®™. Many of hte recent failures of updates and maintainence would not happen if LL®™ did proper testing and planning. If this trend continues the future of SL®™ does not look bright.

  99. isitcatcotton says:

    @70 Yes I understood the podcasts were old from the get go. As far as it’s more of who you know; perhaps it would be wise to listen again to what pathfinder had to say about introducing new ppl in the educational groups to those others. I just don’t spin things when I tell them.

  100. hd1080i says:

    I just wanted to say i think SL and LL is amazing , has been amazing since 2 years ago when i wandered about as a freebbee newbee and now as an island and mainlandowner Hd1080i.

    The variety of inertactions here for education and greater understanding is huge, more so than in any other forum anywhere on this planet.

    You rock. Keep doing. its great. no other place strives for improving what it can at the pace LL has, even if it means we all feel like Beta product users at times, its ALL GOOD.

    i do wish that forsale signs buy speculators were restrained to flat ground level stuff though, it’s kind of a crass treatment of the landscape, but i also believe in freedom enough to recognize that managing a societal virtual microcosm is not easy.

    anyhow Kat Sidewinder torley et al… congrats on all you do. Its really outstanding.

  101. DMCA IS A LIE says:

    Katt is ignoring the question. Why????

  102. Em Warrior says:

    Torley am soooooooooooooooooo happy u put videos in pdf format. is it possible for SL to offer to do this for Groups that are having meetings and only keep mp3/mp4 logs. Maybe offer it to them at a fee. It can’t be that hard and would allow more educators and citizens who can be of great assistancce to individuals new to second life and perhaps they have had no experience dealing with ppl who have special needs, These could be mental illness (any illness/disabilty one can not see. In some cases the person may have a visible/physical illness/disability but do not mention it because of fact that ppl behave online like they do in real. What they don’t know or experience they ignore for the most part.

  103. Katt Linden says:

    @106 DM —

    I’ve answered this question for you in another thread today, but for those who aren’t reading both, but you can read about DMCA here: http://secondlife.com/corporate/dmca.php

    I do understand that there are details about exactly how this works that you’d like to have explained, and I’m sorry, but unfortunately it’s really not something I’m able to do for you, but we have blogged about this, also.

    — Katt

  104. Razor says:

    You didnt answer the question, Katt and it wasn’t in the blog. read back the previous blogs. it was asked by many people in the last DMCA blog, it is often asked by creators inword but linden lab *refuses* to answer. EVERY linden i speak about this *refuses*. *none* of them is able to answer this question, even to the creators that have been ripped of of almost 50% of their collection. Don’t come with those lame excuses, it is something that linden labs doesnt *wants* to answer, not something they cannot.

  105. Razor says:

    WHY dont you ask a linden that knows about how this works. WHY is it that no linden can ask this question to the responsible linden and that in a 300 man company its *impossible* for every linden that NOT A SINGLE LINDEN knows who is responsible for this issue???

  106. Razor says:

    Half of the new Abyss store is already in hundreds of resell stores, Naughty Designs, FNKY RAC, those copyrights are all massively violated and your making money on it and you don’t care.

  107. Silk says:


  108. Electronics Aeon says:

    hello,Silk did u get surveyed?

  109. Electronics Aeon says:

    thank you,please

  110. Aya Pelous says:


  111. Halden Sener says:

    Avatar not loading, teleports not working etc etc but of course the “no comment” gridstatus reports all maters are solved.

  112. Demeter Slade says:

    I really would vote for this issues to be Included in “Service Metrics”
    Cause as a matter of fact SL has been a pain in the ass for the last week, the Asset Server starts breaking down every day arround 7pm the other half of the day you can describe the packetloss as annoying, not to mention that you lose valued Buildings trough Server Restarts. Just a suggestion People, be a bit more honest with your customers and they may not kick in your Teeth when the Status pages give an all clear and while the status says down. Interessting btw Secondlife.com was faster then the Grid Status.

    Have a nice day. And think about that as constructive Critzism. Please
    rather tell us it may take a while and some login outage then to start talking like “it’s gone in a few minutes” While the Assets Server is getting another of his nervous Breakdowns 😛

    Greetings Demy.

  113. Revoled TM says:

    I believe any premium account that has a bit of common sense is on the process of cancelling and say farewell to something that never performs correctly more than 2 hours a day.

  114. Revoled TM says:

    Supposing there’s about 10% of premiums accounts out of all residents ; that cashes LL with a revenue rounding to some US$180 million a year not accounting the land sales or others. Supposing 30% of that revenue part is invested into operations and infrastructure, that makes yet some US$54 millions, including maintenance and sub-contractors fees aso.

    These figures are really bottom line. So why can’t you LL have a decent operating IT, pointing too the fact that you are a small company that -(a)- has few G&A and -(b)- live (or try to) onto one single product as your core business ?

  115. interested citizen says:

    rolling restart to deploy an improvement … how come it usually ends up with everything being totally borked?
    8 hours ago.. I suddenly lost most of my clothes… was unable to rez anything and had lost most of my inventory…
    went to sleep in desperation (no inworld warning) wake up to find the sky has indeed once again fallen…. and SSDD… all is borked..
    methinks rather than the problem being your upstream provider.. t’was your “improvements” that are causing so much trouble

  116. Halden Sener says:

    Yeah now ofcourse the provider is to blame. Well I say “no chance”. We all pay YOU Linden Lab for this. Don’t come throwing third party mistakes at us for your incompetance. But thats not the main thing. The main thing is that with this new Status Page, the residents cannot comment anymore. This resulting in that we have to guess whats going on because LInden is never clear or up to date with the real status of the grid.


    Status: Maps is not working, TP is not working.

  117. Katt Linden says:

    @ Razor

    I’m so sorry that you are not happy with the answers! I personally have answered this question for you as best as I can, several times in the past few days, and I know that other Lindens have done so as well. I’m simply not able to answer in greater detail, partly to protect the privacy of those involved.

    – Every Abuse Report filed is taken care of, in order.

    – We’re not able to publish the details of what happens after the report is filed, which I hope you can all understand!

    And Razor? It’s really not ok for you to keep posting such abusive comments. Kindly do not do so any more. We do notice when those commenting use multiple alts here for such purposes.

    Thank you!
    — Katt

  118. Ravanne Sullivan says:

    [UPDATE 5:51 am PDT] While resolved, we are still seeing some residual effects from our earlier outage

    Whoever wrote that sentence needs to have his head pulled out of whatever orifice it’s shoved up and then be booted to the curb. That is one of the most ludicrise things I have ever seen. if its resolved you do not any residual effects, if you do, IT’S NOT RESOLVED!!!!!

    Not only was it not resolved it quickly went even further down hill. LL®™ really, really needs to learn the meaning of [RESOLVED]™

  119. Katt Linden says:

    @120 Ravanne,

    I’m sorry the language of the Status Report is so annoying for you.

    I assume that the report intends to communicate that the cause of the problem was resolved, although some symptoms may linger for a time?

    Ravanne, thanks for caring so much.

    But I’d really appreciate it if you would moderate your language, when you comment here. That comment is out of line. Thank you!

    — Katt

  120. Ravanne Sullivan says:

    The key to good customer relations is open, honest, clear communications. The status report in question is none of those. Words have meaning, they carry power and the misuse of words will frustrate and anger your customers as they come to expect one thing only to find that their expectaions are false. Posting that an issue has been resolved only to say in the same sentance that there are still some lingering problems just makes you look like a liar. I worked at a place where there was a policy of “It’s done but means your butts done.” If you said a job was complete and then had to qualify it you lied and it was not done.

    As to moderating my language, nothing in my post could not be said in front of a young child. It was however intended to convey my anger and frustrations at the poor communications skills of whoever could write that post with a straight face. It seems to have worked as you replied to it.

    The same company I worked for with the “Done but” policy was at one point considered one of the worst companies as far as customer service. Mangement brought in trainers in communications and everyone in the company had to take the training, owner on down. In one year we went from one of the worst to the best compay that our customer delt with on customer service. Additionally our productivity and profitablity skyrocketed as we learned to better communicate with not just our customers but with each other within the company. If as we have been lead to belief you are here to help with communications you might consider the impact that such training could have within LL®™.

  121. Katt Linden says:

    @122 Ravanne

    I appreciate how much you care about good communications — it’s paramount to me as well.

    Thanks for your suggestions. I will make sure your feedback gets to the folks writing the Status Reports.

    — Katt

  122. Electronics Aeon says:

    hi, thanks for fixing connections but will there be a restart of sims due to the outage?

  123. Electronics Aeon says:

    whoa the region is restarting, thank you so much, you have made my second life experience better! :))

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