Havok4 Preview Updated and Open

The Havok4 preview was temporarily closed, but we’re bringing it back up for testing. We’ll be watching it carefully for crashes and any signs of the content corruption we were worried about yesterday. Thank you to everyone who discovered bugs and entered them into the public list. There is at least one remaining crash mode that we’ve seen happen but do not yet know how to reproduce it, so any help figuring that out would be greatly appreciated.

The particular content corruption we were worried about was some sandbox experiments had mysteriously been linked to one of the “Linden Content” sandbox signs in the corner of the region, which is something that should never have happened. We tracked the event back to right before a crash on the first day the Havok4 preview was opened. Unfortunately the logs were not enough to figure out exactly how it occurred, and the binary core dump of the crash had already been deleted. We need a fresh repeat of the problem so we can examine the pieces and learn the cause.

Here is a list of things that have been fixed or changed:

  • Fixed a crash mode when unlinking an object with scripted actions (hover, buoyancy, vehicle, etc) that were created by a child prim (thanks to Seifert Surface for the object that reproduced the problem)
  • Ground vehicles no longer snag on the terrain
  • SVC-759 llStopMoveToTarget() now activates the object that may have become inactive (thanks to Eyana Yohkoh for entering the bug)
  • SVC-751 linking multi-prim objects together no longer scrambles prim rotations (thanks to Ryozu Kojima for entering the bug, with youtube video)
  • SVC-752 attachments properly save their positions/rotations (thanks to Ryozu Kojima again)
  • Some improvements for sitting avatars
  • Linkability rules have been changed to be closer to the current Havok1 limitations

You can download the HAVOK4 BETA CLIENT HERE (Note: The preview and is completely disconnected from the main Second Life servers, so your main inventory and assets will not be affected by any experiments in the preview.)

About Andrew Linden

Developer at Linden Lab.
This entry was posted in Bugs & Fixes, Development, Preview Grid. Bookmark the permalink.

84 Responses to Havok4 Preview Updated and Open

  1. les says:

    Keep it up Andrew!

    I look forward to testing vehicles with this fix 🙂

  2. shockwave yareach says:

    Cry Havok4, and release the fuzzy bunnies of war!

  3. Brookston Holiday says:

    I know it says it won’t change the dynamic object limit of 31 prims. Does that mean not ever? Will a higher prim limit will be possible in the future? I’ve heard many places that Havok 2,3, and 4 treat linked objects differently and due to this larger objects will be possible, is this incorrect?

    Is the 31 prim limit a limit based on Havok, as it was originally, or is this a decision by Linden Labs for some other reason?

  4. Vincent Nacon says:

    the limit may go more after Havok 4 is released into all of the servers. Just can’t go more than 32 prims while some servers are still using Havok 1.

    I think…

  5. So what’s the LARGEST_MAX for linking in this release and what will it be in the final release?

  6. Andrew Linden says:

    The 31 prim limit for dynamic objects will not change in Havok4. Under the new physics engine the limit has more to do with region crossing problems/lag than physics performance. That is, the lag and pauses at region crossings are caused by expensive save/load of objects and their scripts, not by the cost of destroying/adding the collision shapes to the physics engine. Bumping the prim limit would allow people to make more content that exacerbates the region crossing problem — we want to fix it before we make it worse.

  7. Andrew Linden says:

    @5 Candide, I added a link to the linkability rules in the blog post. The new rules measure the “span” of the two candidate objects (basically it is the diameter of the smallest sphere that bounds both object’s spheres) and then compare that value to a maximum_span. The MAX_SPAN is set at 54 meters.

    If anyone has some valid content that links in Havok1 but not in Havok4 I’d be very interested in examining it and using it to test any further refinements to the new linkability rules.

  8. ItsNaughtKnotty Cannned says:

    Thank you Lindens for working on the physics in Second Life. I can live with the 31 prim limit … I find it to be a challenge in smart design and building … but what drives me crazy is the zany ways scripted vehicles react in our world. I’m not a programmer and I’ve been using all the public domain scripts to make my vehicles run. Even with my limited experience, I’m finding so many problems with the current environment that ANY upgrade will be welcome by me. I’ve driven some of my scooters around on the beta grid and they already seem to be happier there.

  9. shockwave yareach says:

    Andrew:

    You could improve performance if you presend the data to the next sim when you are within 15m of it, so the simcrossing because transparent. If you never cross into that sim but go back across the 15m line, you tell the next sim it may dump its cache copy.

  10. Andrew Linden says:

    Shockwave, pre-emptive sending of the data is a promising solution. Unfortunately there are uh… inflexibilities within our codebase that make that a harder solution than you might expect. Some sections of the code need to be overhauled before we could do that. The Havok4 work has cleaned a lot of stuff, but there is still much to be done.

  11. Neural says:

    Shockwave: good idea, but, though my knowledge on this is limited, it would seem to me that it would run into problems in areas where there are a lot of individual using vehicles near sim borders. Depends on how much data has to be cached I guess.

    Andrew: Can we get clarification on what you want people to do with the beta grid right now. There have been disputes and AR’s filed over arguments about what sort of testing they want done. do you want controlled experiments? Mass physical prim dumping? or other?

  12. Farallon Greyskin says:

    Uh, why has all the land in the beta grid been set to no rez?

  13. Farallon Greyskin says:

    Ok, not ALL of it but all the lower sandbox areas that are nice and empty and were open before…

  14. Andrew Linden says:

    I don’t think I need any more tests of large piles of dynamic objects trying to lag the physics engine into submission. There have been a lot of such tests and the system has held up. I’m more worried about a some fragile part of the code that tickles an unknown crash-bug where we add or remove objects. Some fragile parts of the code include attachments, scripted objects, linking/delinking, shape changes, and avatars, especially sitting avatars.

    One clue I have about the mysterious crash bug is that it appears to be related to an object that was “removed” from the world (by deletion, going outside the region, or taken to inventory) but was not properly cleaned up, such that there was a dangling reference to an invalid object (but NOT freed memory) in a list that should not have any invalid objects in it. So it looks like the break happens at one point (I’d really like to know where) but the simulator continues to do business as usual until it encounters that bad reference and asserts at a later time.

    There is one other clue that might be relevant… the object that crashed the region was not rezzed from inventory or another object… it was created fresh by hand. However, I only had time to examine one example closely, so this might not be a requirement for reproducing the problem.

  15. Farallon Greyskin says:

    Aaaand other areas that do allow res are set to one minute auto return., Is there a group you have to join now to test there?

    Also, in the short time I was testing, the extreme slowness and lag is still present. The havok 4 sims run physics MUCH slower than at home on my private sim, even though the current script and physics loads of the beta sims are FAR lower than my class 4 sims.

    I saw that this was a known concern, has there been any progress on hunting that down? I was hoping that after many years and 3 versions that Havok would have become /somewhat/ more efficient, but now I just hope we are not going backwards with the efficiency.

    I can’t find anything in the wiki other ohter than talk about how physics engines inherently are slow with multiple interacting objects. Can you shed some light on the comparitive slowness of the beta grid/havok 4 with the main grid/havok 1? Is it just the beta simulators running on class 3 mahcines? Running in debug mode? or as yet unknown? (ALso if there IS a wiki entry discussing this, I’d like to see it, finding things is hit or miss in there..)

  16. Farallon Greyskin says:

    Sorry, I should add that this slowness is actually redily apparent merely by dragging a single physical ball across a large flat non pysical box. So it’s not even that there are 10 or 100 objects interacting, it’s just with one.

  17. Andrew Linden says:

    There have been 4 crashes in the last half hour. Three of them are new, the fourth is the one I was looking for — in Sandbox Cordova. Dunno why it happened yet, I’m looking into it.

  18. Valor says:

    An object that I made on the main grid and rezzed from inventory on the Havok4 grid has crashed the Havok4 sims three times so far.. though, it’s not entirely reproducable.

    Hopefully some of the following information will be useful in determining a way to reproduce it and fix it.

    So far, I’ve used the object 20+ times and it’s crashed the sim 3. It’s a ‘hatching egg’. Once rezzed it asks you to allow it to delink. It’s 30 prim that are cut hollow shards of a sphere, that you sit on. Then you stand up you end up in the center of the chaos of the prim that make up the sphere exploding around you.

    It employs two ‘cludges’ to overcome Havok1’s failure to turn prim physical when they are interpenetrating an avatar. First, each prim that make up the egg have a script in them. The root prim sends out a linked message to the child prim before it delinks that starts a timer in the child prim scripts. The object’s root prim script sets temp, physical, delinks and the individual prim scripts fire their timer and turn themselves physical again.. then apply a 1m impulse.
    The root prim also rezzes a heavy object on top of it all to collide with it.

    This causes ‘most’ of the shards of the sphere to become physical and explode.

    The shards were made to exactly reproduce a sphere with no spaces in between. So, physically, there’s a point of critical collision where all of the shards are touching and colliding with each other before they explode outward.

    It seems to crash more often when the physics system *isn’t* under a crushing load of replicating physical objects.

  19. Valor says:

    .. there it goes again :/

  20. Valor says:

    .. and again. :/

  21. Valor says:

    okay.. it’s officially reproducable now.

  22. Andrew Linden says:

    Yeah, ok. I’ve got enough broken pieces to look at — I’ll be busy the rest of the day. The next update of the preview will be next week sometime. It would be helpful if you were to enter bugs you find at jira.secondlife.com and tag their title with “Havok4”. Be sure to check for duplicates before you add new ones.

    I’m going to look the preview over at the end of the day and will decide if I should close it for the weekend or not.

  23. kracker ultsch says:

    i need some help logging in
    do i have to creat a new account or use my one i already have. it keeps telling me to make sure caps lock is off.

  24. Ponk Bing says:

    Your av probably isn’t old enough.

  25. I’ve got a couple of ideas to discuss, if I might, Andrew. I’d email them, but I don’t have your work address, and I’m not sure how often you check your forum IMs anymore. If you could perhaps pass me your address in world?

  26. aeper jie says:

    Yea now if the sim crosses where better vechs would be cool

  27. Andrew Linden says:

    Feynt, you can either discuss them here in the comments, send me email directly at andrew@lindenlab.com, or come to my office hours, which are currently scheduled for Tuesdays 16:30 – 15:30 PST.

    http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/User:Andrew_Linden

  28. Ah ha, you DO have office hours. Sadly I’m at school from 2pm till 9pm EST, and in transit from 11am, so I’ll never be able to make that. But email I can do.

  29. WarKirby Magojiro says:

    Andrew. Why close the preview over the weekend? crashed regions always come back up, don’t they? why not just leave it open to play with.

  30. WarKirby Magojiro says:

    Aaagh. Georgean was my favorite place for testing because it allowed terraforming. Now terraforimg AND build are disabled. What use is that? can’t test anything if we can’t rez objects

  31. Andrew Linden says:

    I did a quick scan of the preview regions and did not notice any corrupted objects, so I’ve decided to leave the preview up over the weekend.

    I’ve recieved one object from a resident who claims it can reliably crash a region (thanks Teravus Ousley) so I’ll be using that on Monday to figure out how to fix it. If anyone finds another such object please drop a copy on me in the preview.

    Thanks! Have a good weekend.

  32. Andrew Linden says:

    I changed Georgean so you can create objects, and divided out a medium parcel where you can edit the terrain.

    I also enabled “create objects” in a few other regions and set some autoreturns to an hour or less. It looks like there is enough open space to test stuff out this weekend. At most the preview had about 50 residents on it today — I expect it to be pretty empty most of Saturday and Sunday.

  33. U M says:

    keep up the good work andrew…………….And thank you for the update

  34. WarKirby Magojiro says:

    Andrew. I found the apparently terraformable parcel. And About land confirms this, but trying to edit the terrain gives me a popup

    “The region Georgean does not allow terraforming”

    Can you fix that?

  35. Seven Shikami says:

    Is it a valid bug report to say “Something that worked under Havok 1 does not work the same under Havok 4”?

    I make a skeeball game which works just fine in H1, but the same game on the Beta grid causes the ball to bounce wildly incorrectly in H4. Sometimes snapping hard left, sometimes a pop fly straight up, etc…

    It’s hard to tell what constitutes “That’s just how real physics should have worked and is not a bug” and what’s “H4 is screwed up.”

    Could use some Linden guidance here…

  36. Zennia Zenovka says:

    How about getting on FIXING the main grid. Money transactions timing out. Can not upload images or animations. Inventory not loading completely, friends list comes and goes. TP’s not working correctly, timing out.

    How about it????

  37. Ron Crimson says:

    Seven:

    since LL’s current goal is to make the H4 implementation work just like H1 (before adding new features), that would certainly qualify as a bug report. Go ahead and hit up JIRA with it. 🙂

  38. mimi says:

    completely off topic, but thanks for warning us about not operating on no copy items! its very much appreciated! 🙂

  39. Coventina Dalgleish says:

    Without a stable operations you can introduce anything you like and it will make no difference. Now it is the weekend again and we receive this little tidbit

    “We are experiencing gridwide slowdowns that may cause issues with search, mapping, teleporting, inworld payments, asset operations and display of inworld $L balances.”

    Why don’t you work on your infrastructure and support systems first instead of adding more items to slap the wings off of this bug, and it has turned into one very large bug.

    Don’t get me wrong it should be interesting, well that is if anyone can use it.

    Seems to me , and i might be incorrect, but this is an eternal problem with your vehicle. It just repeats and repeats until it becomes an irritation to play. One might think someone there would make notes and prepare preventative maintenance to prevent the self destruction of your PAYING user base.

  40. mimi says:

    Covenia isn’t that what they are trying with havoc4?

    Making things more stable… less crashes and smoother gameplay?

  41. TigroSpottystripes Katsu says:

    “Linkability rules have been changed to be closer to the current Havok1 limitations”

    does this means you’re crippling it or improving it? if it s the first, why?

  42. Ron Crimson says:

    @41:

    Re-read the entire blog again, slowly. It answers that question very clearly.

    😉

  43. Corax Homewood says:

    You complainers, shut up already! I’ve heard enough. This update makes things work better and more stable – if you think that’s reason to complain, then you are so far out of touch there’s no point in even listening to what you have to say.

  44. Giuliani Rossini says:

    This isn’t really on topic for the thread, but it’s something that’s been bothering me for a while.

    I understand that in an evolving environment like this, things are going to break. But why do you keep breaking the *same stuff*? And taking days to fix it? Once it’s happened twenty times one would think it’d be an easy fix.

  45. Siena Masala says:

    Can anyone tell me why on some days i continually crash by becoming frozen , my mini-map turns red, the voice still works and i can see my avatar but no one else can? only a re-log solves the problem. This then happens 3 or 4 times before the whole thing settles down.

  46. Borky Grid says:

    @43

    not sure which grid you are on…Since the last update it got worse again. Just crashes, slow downs & bad performance in general. Traffic was updated twice this week instead of 5 times.

    I uploaded the new viewer on one of my pc´s but not on the other. Guess where it runs better. Of course on the old viewer…

    Now i wouldn´t tell anyone to shut up. But watch your mouth buddy.

    @45
    cannot tell you why, but me and friends also have that since the last update.

  47. Borky Grid says:

    btw, search etc., just seems to shut down again..or at least slow down again…no search results now for minutes. Cannot even load my profile properly. Great, another weekend without things going normal and me having the chance to make a normal revenue for paying my tier.

    Thanx…But great we got Havok4 now…

  48. william Fish says:

    #47.. ditto… i couldnt even tp. i had to log out then log in to the place i wanted to go.

    sorry to place this here.. no where else to do it. AND yes btw i have sent bug reports… about 40 mins ago and still no cool blue window saying lindens are aware of the prob… which btw i give props to the lindens. Lately when things stop working like this they are quick to let everyone know they are working on the prob.

  49. Borky Grid says:

    But at least i get free traffic now, cose campers don´t seem to get paid either…Just too bad that they usually blame me for it.

  50. Damona Rau says:

    No TP
    No Search
    No Profiles
    With 29.000 Residents it feels like 100.000 (ok, we never had)
    But Linden tells, the slowdowns are resolved…

    Whats resolved? That the coffee-machine is empty?
    I hope really that this is resolved later, because there are many Events today, at least my event…

    A tip for you Linden-Guys:
    At first fix ALL Problems before you add new things. That means, remove Havok4 again, fix the grid and test on the Betagrid the Havok4. Your Het-Grid don’t work, so don’t bother your residents with your Alphatests.

    Damona

  51. Klaatu Congrejo says:

    @ AndrewLinden. Slightly off-topic maybe, but its great to see you interacting with the community with your frequent replies in this blog. Makes a change from you guys just posting a blog that requires further explanation and then going home for the weekend – leaving SL residents pleading for answers or ‘translations’ to the blogpost.
    This kind of involvement reassures the community that you really are listening to us and trying your best to keep in touch with your customer base. Not all of us are computer-literate and we need simple and EZ2-understand ‘word pictures’ of what you are really trying to tell us sometimes!

    Keep up the good work. :))

  52. Zennia Zenovka says:

    Don’t you just love it!!! SL is totally borked again. Another weekend, everybody went home and just left the mess. Issue Resloved my avi butt. Way to go Lindens. Sure shows how much you value us.

  53. Uccello says:

    From Comment #14 “…an object that was “removed” from the world (by deletion, going outside the region, or taken to inventory) but was not properly cleaned up,”

    Sounds like the Ghost Prims that i encounter frequently. A avie can “trip” over or be stopped by the persistent presence of a prim or group of prims despite the removal of same. This is not the Ghost Avie issue i see frequently when a player is ejected from a sim, where the avie is visible but “phantom” to collisions. In fact, I have a build in place right now where there seem to be a few Ghost Prims seemingly linked to the main body and they won’t go away after many sim restarts.

    Any ideas?

  54. U M says:

    I sure hope you people fix that rotation bug crash issue! And the memory leak! This is getting old! I did not have these issues with the non voice client But Now i stuck with this crap client!

    U sagi M usashi

  55. Sabbrinna Sinatra says:

    Hey …Glad to hear you have the test grid all fixed up. Now do you think you all can find time to fix the main grid? This is pathetic.

  56. Zennia Zenovka says:

    Beta = ?? Can not attach and detach huds, animation overrider (cgbg) not working but attached, animations that work are very different than main grid. Not impressed at this point. How about getting all the sims on the same server version????

    Main Grid is borked, beta is well… beta. Guess I will go to the beach.

  57. Hint says:

    ahm, the “the system is currently unable to process your request rallye” seems to start again just now…Sorry, don´t want to go through support

  58. Zennia Zenovka says:

    Main Grid = TP’s down, search down, Lindens Gone….

  59. Hint says:

    Yep, confirmed

  60. Hint says:

    account balance also gone…there goes another night of revenues…

  61. IntLibber Brautigan says:

    Here’s a way to crash a Havoc 4 sim thats been discovered:

    a) take a noob car, any noob car
    b) delink its prims
    c) turn each prim physical
    d) link them back together
    e) delink them again
    f) BOOM

    No special tricks or scripting help required, just something any noob may try to do in any given sandbox on any given day. Hope you can fix it…

  62. Hint says:

    @61

    Not sure that one was a good idea…but anyhoo, if it´s that simple…I am not surprised about last weeks crash series

    @LL

    I honestly think, it´s time for a lil gesture again. Like extending the classifieds or some L$ reimbursement, simply for every one.

    While the economy is going down, these crashes are simply not to compensate for small businesses anymore.

    What stops you from just running the L$ printers on double speed for a few days and make everyone smile again?

    Good Luck fixing Lindens 🙂

    LOL while i am writing and relogging, matter seems solved again

    Geez what a rollercoaster

  63. Alyx Sands says:

    #50: Havok 4 IS ON THE BETA GRID. It has NOTHING to do with the main Grid. It won’t bother you, and besides, this IS being tested to make SL more stable. Maybe you want to read up on what the Beta Grid is again. It’s a completely DIFFERENT grid.

  64. Lestat Demain says:

    DAMN I WISH U LINDENS WOULD STOP SCREWING WITH THE PACKET ORDERING AND DROPPING JUST TO MAKE THE NEXT CLIENT LOOK LIKE AN IMPROVEMENT!!!!
    I goto all the trouble of improving my client just to have that crap pulled every update?

  65. omar says:

    holas
    soy españosl,tengo deseos de jugar pero no puedo, cuando esta cargando me pide q ensienda,UN ALLAVE DE CERRADURA DE CASQUILLOS,nose como se ase, nose si alguien me puede ayudar

    GRACIAS..

  66. Whata Week says:

    @63

    but you will admit, that all the trouble this week (next to the usual problems & the screwed last update) started just b4, this blog post was published…and i don´t really believe in coincendences.

    also it´s the only blog still open for comments…Actually wonder why that is? Well no i don´t…

    If you walk around the grid and talk to people (that are not into big time scripting or understand it infrastructure & systems), lots of them condemn this havok4 thingie without knowing what it is. I don´t know either…Just know we got more problems since its in the news…

    Still I plead for generous gestures from LL. This week was a complete and utter desaster.

    But the good news is that lawsuit is out of the way. Puh…what a relief

    Happy weekend to you all 🙂

  67. FERNANDO says:

    mi idioma es el español poco entiendo de ingles no han pensado en colocar una version en español?????

  68. Renee Faulds says:

    Why does your software cause three computers to crash ????

    any little Linden want to anser that????

    I dought it…………

  69. Renee Faulds says:

    cc:CNN

  70. sirhc DeSantis says:

    beta – can’t move at all. alpha ie what we live with incredibly slow
    did i miss something?

  71. Andrew Linden says:

    @61 IntLibber Brautigan I have trouble believing that unlinking a vechicle crashes a Havok4 simulator, however I will try it out on Monday. Under certain circumstances the recipe you provided would crash in Havok1 so I wonder if you were really in a region that was using the new physics engine.

    There are some Havok1 regions up in the Havok4 preview. They are all named something like “Foo Havok1”. They are there so that people can compare the behavior of their content under Havok1 and Havok4 nearly side by side.

  72. Whata Week says:

    And btw, sorry I puke into this blog all them time…You folks may want to open the comment section on the relevant blogs, so others won´t be used to make a statement.

    This weekend was for me the one with worst grid experience ever. Revenues are a joke. Thanks for having stabilized the grid when no one is on anymore. I wonder what happens if we get close to 40000 users again…

    Please no more updates soon but instead please compensations for everyone!!!!!!

  73. DR Dahlgren says:

    I am wondering if Beta is the only place Havoc 4 is being tested, or if someone is tweeking Main Havoc 1. Ever since this last week, I have noticed behaviors in physics on Main that are different results than what I got in the past. The distance between physical objects needed to not be in collision seems to have changed. The behavior of physical objects that interact in other ways, such as rings on a bar (hollow cylinders over a second cylinder) has changed to where the objects jump away from each other when released from edit. These are objects that were created and used to work a few weeks ago.

    I guess I am wondering what resources the two grids, Main and Beta might share, and if there might be some cross interaction between the two that are now causing issues for Main.

    DRD

  74. Milo Bellow says:

    I Want To Complain About The Inability To Post Comments After This Post!

    SL Performance At The Moment Is DISGUSTING!

    I Just Logged Out Rather Than Endure Any More.

    Sunday SL Sucks -.-

  75. a) Has anyone tested the “w00t” script yet? (I made a bowling game that uses it.)

    b) Any chance of using “current” pw’s to log in to beta?.. PW’s I create are very complex and aren’t written down for later references.

    c) Any reason we are not just going to Havoc 5? we could be doing all this testing on the newest version intead of having to do it down the line? (that’s a curiousity, not a complaint.. I swear lol.)

  76. Coventina Dalgleish says:

    Well SL made the NBC network news tonight showing how students use it as a virtual classroom. This was a very nice piece, unfortunately they did not mention that your question might or might not be answered because of lag.

    In reply to the person who answered my last post that with havok 4 they are TRYING to make it more stable. Well I get up every morning and flap my arms as fast and hard as I can in an attempt to fly, I have never lifted 1mm off the floor. Some things are just not meant to be. As long as we have real time writes to hard drives you will see lag dependent on concurrency. It seems every sim crossing and teleport causes this action.

    Past performance (very little) is no guarantee of future profits or performance.

    I also am not convinced that havok 4 will add the performance that the voice system has removed.

    And to you who are tired of listening to those of us who voice complaints, every update since 6.0 has increased bugs and problems. This is a pretty bad track record of performance and if many had not made good friends here I am sure we would be observing a great wasteland as the strength of the game is in the world wide friends that are created.

    It would appear to an outside observer that there is a serious problem with the architecture of the base design. It has been proved many times that this structure has a limited ability to scale.

    In closing why do the same problems (after you fix them) repeat, scripting errors, repeating inventory problems, it seems someone has a pet project to re enter code that does not function.

  77. concerned says:

    @77.c I believe that an upgrade to havok has been at least 18 months coming to my knowledge and probably a lot longer.It was originally going to be havok 2 upgrade but i think its fair to stick with 4 now as a lot of bug testing is going on so obviously its been incorperated to a standard that will improve lag and sim stability.

    By time they would retest everything to get to 5 havok will have new updates so what i think we need is to get this upgrade in place then this will have caught up a lot and newer upgrades hopefully will be less work to test and a lot of lessons learned.

    If SL was like halflife 2 etc where you just play through then physics would be much easier to test then i would the latest versions but in a live world where you can build link cut script etc you will always be chasing because debugging if that much harder.

  78. Arcadian Meili says:

    Not much news in it – so poor movements. Thought that Havoke 4 was supposed to change that.

  79. Gaius Goodliffe says:

    @6 Andrew Linden: That makes perfect sense, fix that before upping that limit to prevent vehicles from getting more expensive to save/load. I have one question, though — do avatars sitting on an object make it more complex to save/load? If not, it would be nice if we could at least lose the last part of the old formula “31 minus one for each avatar sitting on the object”. It’s painful having to lose two prims for each passenger (one for the passenger seat, and another for the avatar that will be using it), especially when you make vehicles with a touring or otherwise social focus.

  80. Storyof Oh says:

    …then we were one…..
    interesting the 9 million user claim has disappeared, now just over 1 million log ins in last 60 days…4l k online …allowing for alts and crashes on a global basis that isn’t many.
    Ok off topic but no comments open elsewhere
    Havok is so like the UK havoc…carnage, damage ..desolation…chaos…confusion…….yup SL all right 🙂
    the sunset on the water is very pretty…….

  81. Dean Ashby says:

    Due to comments closed everywhere ..one thing to the VAT discussion and the “no-effect” on SL-members … i got 14 offers to buy 23 islands in 2 days cause ppl dont want to spend anymore money on havin FUN!! not sell ..
    Btw im not in Real Estate lol … thx

  82. Darling Brody says:

    Andrew Linden,

    Many of the old faithful scripted objects are not responding normaly.

    llMoveToTarget objects start spinning when they are moved. This is going to mess up all the existing flying pets and other objects that relied on the object staying upright by itself.

    Elevators that use llSetBuoyancy to lift a numbe rof people together do not work. Testing shows llSetBuoyancy can be -1,0,+1 but that is all. To lift a number of people together requires a lot more buoyancy than that.

    One of my teleporters uses buoyancy instead of warppos to get you over the 768 limit for a realiy private skybox. On the beta grid it cant even lift my feet off the ground. Looks like I might have to rename my skybox to groundbox. LOL

    Attachments that use impulases, buoyancy, and movetotarget are also behaving strangly. They seem to treat the avatar as if they are nonphysical until the avatar starts moving. This makes previously smooth fligh assist scripts jerky as hell. It breaks the movelock alltogether.

    I also have an object that creates an instant crash in the beta grid. Region offline immedeiatly! The object is harmless on the main grid. IM me in world and I’ll show you.

    It is wonderfull that people can’t crash a region with physical objects anymore. It is even better that physical object spam will not lag avatar moment to hell. I am sure the in world lindens will be overjoyed at not having to clean up the sandbox all the time. As will those of use who use them. Good job so far. 🙂

    Darling.

  83. misael says:

    i am brazilian
    please
    one brazilian talk

  84. Pingback: The Big Prim Problem « Second Life Conceptual Creations

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