Hey! What happened to my comment?

Watermelon Web two-point-oh Badge (PNG version)Friendly greetings! It’s me, Torley Linden, Community Developer of Communications. In the midst of another productive day @ Linden Lab, I wanted to take the time to answer some of your blog-related questions:
 

Q: Hey! What happened to my comment?

A: Before commenting, please make sure you are familiar with our Guidelines for Blog Comments. As it says in there:

The first time you ever make a comment here, it will be held in our moderation queue until we can manually approve it. This is because of our anti-spam measures. Subsequent comments usually go through directly. Thanks for your patience.

Also, please don’t send a single comment many times, because comments which look like spam will be flagged as such. We already have enough spam to deal with, so please stand out. As of now, 7,777 spam caught since we moved to WordPress VIP.)
 

Q: Why do some posts have comments closed? Did you delete my comment?

A: Hrmmm a 2-for-1, I see! Tricky! But here goes: (1) Some posts are informational announcements, so we’re not in need of new info or โ€” we already know what’s going on, and will give YOU that new info. And (2) If it fell afoul of our Blog Guidelines then likely, yes.

We’ll continue to have plenty of posts with open comments, where we welcome your fresh feedback. Like this one. Tell me something I don’t know so I can learn from you!
 

Q: Why won’t you answer my support question? I need help!

A: Ah, the Official Linden Blog isn’t an official place to get that kind of assistance from us! That’s precisely why I added the Widget on the right sidebar: Need help? Please visit our Support Page.

In case that’s not clear enough, we’re going to add a pointer right next to the comment form too. Oh! You’ll also want to read Robin’s recent post about our future Customer Service changes. ๐Ÿ™‚
 

Q: Are Widgets (definition in link) flashy eye candy?

A: They can be, and they can also be nutritiously substantial. Leading off from earlier, Widgets were added because we need to make a diversity of content changes rapidly. They’re a necessity for our blog to adapt more flexibly, and update more frequently; it’s been a long and winding road we’re still traveling.

End result: making it easier for you to get timely news, organized helpfully, with fun!

Some of this will be a lot clearer when we look back… please remind me in a year’s time that I made this post.
 

Q: Why aren’t you talking about packet loss, sim crashes, other problems, etc.?

A: I hear this one a surprising lot. Answer is, we sure are. Did you see Joshua Linden’s recent post? Or all the recent Grid Status updates? Many Lindens post here, and I’m working on a way to get an authors’ list. At last count, 40+ Lindens have contributed!

If you’re having difficulties finding hot topics here, then that’s where we might be able to tweak Widgets to make things better. And as mentioned before, comments with open entries are done with the purpose of discussion and learning things we don’t already know from our community. See? It’s all connected.

Additionally, this keeps coming up: the myth that all Lindens have supercomputers and flawless connections. Wish that were true, but I’ve been hit harder with packet loss than most of our Resis. So if you wanna come ’round, pull up a chair, and sympathize about your packet loss woes, I do relate. Infact, I’ve been a lightning rod for everything from inventory loss to UI wonkiness to prim drift. To say the least, it keeps me grounded, and helps me communicate this relevance with my fellow Lindens, so we understand what’s important to you.
  

This is an actual comment I got:

Q: Bastards closed commenting on the next two blog entriesโ€ฆ. how can we bitch if they keep closing the blog entries to comments?

A: Please don’t be nasty. ๐Ÿ˜ฆ This blog is about communication. ๐Ÿ™‚

But… this blog ain’t for bitching. Remember, this is THE INTERNETS, it’s SERIOUS BUSINESS. There are plenty of places you can bitch, like your own blog, or some Resident-run forums are okay with that too. So, you gotta lot of choices, and one of them is: instead of bitching, please help us improve Second Life for you.
 

Bonus questions:

Q: Why are you using UTC-8? That’s confusing.

A: Pardon for my nature as an avatar time traveler, as noticed in my last post, the “UTC-8” was confusing some of you. Eventually, we hope to go towards that direction, but today… PST it is. So now, TIMES IN PST!
 

Q: Why do you get so excited about little things, Torley?

A: Because it’s worth it. Apathy is useless, and to riff on Herbert, fear of happiness is the mindkiller. I’m excited about big things, too, being more of an AND person than an OR person.

There’s a lot of context to this, but I’m not here today to tell my life story.

I’m certainly happy you’re here with us in Second Life!

letus

About Torley

Who am I? See http://torley.com/
This entry was posted in Blog Improvements, Community, Q&A, Resident Experience. Bookmark the permalink.

101 Responses to Hey! What happened to my comment?

  1. Mako Mabellon says:

    PST is probably clearer for Americans, but I suspect UTC-8 (or GMT-8) makes more sense to the rest of the world (especially Europe). I know I can’t be bothered to keep track of all the different US timezones and their offsets from GMT…

    Of course, I’m probably wrong.

  2. SignpostMarv says:

    Heh. If you do a google on comments I’ve made on this blog, you’ll see I regularly trip up Akismet ๐Ÿ™‚

    I think I tripped it up yesterday ๐Ÿ˜€

  3. ninjafoo Ng says:

    GMT Dammit – We invented time!

  4. Niaht Nakamichi says:

    Thank you Torley, and the all the rest of you Lindens too. For doing it, putting up with it, dealing with it, and continuting to dream. Sorry, nothing new to tell you really… though I can happily bitch, moan, *and* groan, that in my little slice of SL heaven, things are going really quite well.
    ~ 8-}

  5. SignpostMarv says:

    Mako Mabellon

    I know I canโ€™t be bothered to keep track of all the different US timezones and their offsets from GMTโ€ฆ

    This is not an invitation to go-off topic about LSL: A project I’m working on (well, it’s kinda done already) means I have to keep track of ALL timezones, not just the ones in the US.

  6. Luciftias says:

    How do you maintain a positive outlook, Torley?

    I would dearly love to know and implement the recommendations in my own life.

    My own preferred strategy of devising elaborate Auric Goldfinger style traps for my childhood G.I. Joe toys is wearing a bit thin.

  7. Mark Barrett says:

    I really liked the made up SLT. Of course in the end it’s all the same.

  8. etherkye Hansen says:

    theres only 24 time zones, can’t be that bad XD

    *hugs torley*

  9. Oooh we have comments! Thanxies! *big huggerz*

    @Lucifitias: Wonderful question! Answer: years ago, I was severely depressed and suicidal after one personal tragedy after another struck me. Some of it is rather graphic and I won’t get into it here, but… to some, perhaps it sounds like such a clichรฉ: if that’s the case, I was certainly living my own hell! ๐Ÿ˜ฆ

    I became desperate to do a 180-degree turn. The idea was easy, the actions of becoming happier were not. There were a lot of events that happened along the way, and a big part of it is making friends in Second Life. So whenever I start to get sad, I remember how bad things once were for me, and am soooo grateful for what I have now. ๐Ÿ™‚

    I’ve had enough sadness for at least two lifetimes! That’s why I’m so happy today. ๐Ÿ˜€

    So to anyone who wonders, no, I wasn’t always the cheery, watermelon-loving YAYZERAMA!!!! person you see today. The absolute opposite, infact. Been there, done that โ€” negative redundancy โ€” I’ve moved on.

    A key tangible thing I do: whenever I observe something that makes me happy, I comment on it, or share it with the one(s) responsible. Such as all the great creativity that’s been birthed in SL. I find making others happy brings a lot of happiness back my way. Which is why I’m so eager to help here, and why it cuts so deeply when there’s pain. Both personally and professionally.

    On chronology: drives me crazy, can we go Swatch beats already? ๐Ÿ˜‰

  10. stephe erhler says:

    Yea I could sit here and bitch about lag, objects not rezing at times etc but SL is so much fun and to me amazing it works as well as it does given the recent load, all I can say is thanks guys for your hard work!

    Stephe Ehrler

  11. Pointless says:

    It’s pointless closing comments – people just leave their comments on the last post that has open comments anyway.

    By all means encourage constructive criticism and discourage unnecessary bitching etc., but don’t close comments – it makes you look like you are too arrogant to care what residents think.

  12. RC Paderborn says:

    Regarding PST vs GMT-8 (or even UTC-8)…

    Just report all time in Internet beats! Right now it’s @013 (3:20PM GMT-8). Am I the only person on the planet left with a Swatch clock showing me Internet time? :LOL:

  13. Ultra Nefarious says:

    Since all the other blogs are now closed to comment, I find myself in the probably incorrect position of putting this comment here.

    Earlier, as I was setting up part of my new store (for those who are curious, this was NOT a good couple of days to try to pull that off), most of my rezzing issues seemed to be resolving themselves. I placed a wall and some store signs, and a lot of artwork. Now that I log back in, the store seems to have reverted. A wall I deleted is back and most of the artwork and one of the signs are now missing. Luckily enough, it looks like most of the stuff is in my inventory, so it isn’t totally lost, but a couple of hours of work just went down the drain. Again. Some more.

  14. Jeffery Feingold says:

    Lack of happiness leads to fear and Yoda said the rest.
    Just a sub note. Back in the day when Slashdot was old enough to have a bunch of users and new enough to have not enough bandwidth for them all people all thought they had great connections to Slashdot as after all they owned it.
    Yeah they owned it but after collage they had to ship the server to a hosting service so they connect remote like everyone else.
    When they did a short run of eppisodes for a short lived internet radio program they wanted to comment on a story on the website so they started pulling it up … dead air then “Here at slashdot … bandwidth sucks…” They couldn’t connect to the server and had to recall the story from memory or just quickly changed the topic. I forget.

    Yeah I can see people thinking you guys log into SL by sitting at a server.
    Byond the mad move it would be to even use the servers for any client side tasks, Yeah. Servers at hosting service? Am I right? And the Lindens each at home.

    Yeah I do bitch about the lag. I do it on my own lj and in world. I also bitch about stubing my toe. A place for everything and everything in it’s place.
    Besides bitching dosen’t resolve things it just gives the bitcher a chance to hear it and give friends an understanding of the bad mood and need for large bucket of chocolate ice cream or 12 rounds of FPS gaming or whatever it is that makes the bitcher happy again.

  15. bazzerbill says:

    Only 24 times zones?
    Technically there in an infinite number of times zones.
    24 hour jumps, or 1440-minute jumps or 86400 second jumps.
    The time between the zones mite get smaller and smaller but they are still zones.
    You need to be that accurate almost in order to navigate.
    The whole resign GMT was agreed upon in the first place.

  16. Bucky Barkley says:

    Torley, you are doing wonderfully at communicating. This
    needs to be true for other facets of the service.

    What needs to be passed on is this: there’s tons of anxiety out
    there about all of the tech issues. The CTO should be addressing
    these publically.. not a month from now, but _right now_. So pass
    this on… someone with the technical chops to explain what
    is going on needs to do a Town Hall very soon. They need
    to show leadership, they need to communicate, and they need
    to lay out a clear schedule of what should happen, and when.

  17. Stone MacAlpine says:

    My solution to the time zone problem:

    I’ve replaced the clock on my computer with one that shows multiple time zones, for example:

    Right now I can see –

    Local – 10:45am Dec 1
    Second Life – 3:45pm 30 Nov

  18. StevenSDF Fisher says:

    So much arguing over time… just scrap them all! ๐Ÿ˜€
    “[cottage cheese O’Clock] This thing went ping”
    Much better! ๐Ÿ˜€

    Or, if you have somethinig like the personalised google home page thing, stick a gadget on there that allows you to see PST, then when you read this blog, have the other page ready loaded in a sidebar, another tab or window and you can easily see. ๐Ÿ™‚

    I like your your cheery outlook, Torley, so very like mine! ๐Ÿ˜€ ๐Ÿ™‚ ^_^

  19. xfahctor ceres says:

    just wanted to thank the family linden, i have to give props on
    this latest round of updtaes/upgrades…..its actualy running better
    for me than it ever has, given the mammoth scope of what you
    have put together here, truly amazing world. thanx guys….
    ….heres to you
    ‘ere

  20. Fledhyris Proudhon says:

    Hi Torley

    I certainly love your approach that the blog is for communicating. Unfortunately, my experience so far has been that unless you have only positive things to say, nobody wants to know, and the blog format is engineered in such a manner as to make effective communication nigh on impossible.

    No comment threading or tag features.
    People asked to comment, then sniped at when they do so.
    Communication with anyone other than the original poster frowned upon.
    Freedom of speech and polite self expression frowned upon.
    Constructive criticism shrugged off if not outright deplored.
    And the best one so far, people being asked to submit bug reports inworld, as they can’t be effectively harvested from the blog, but when I comment in other ways, I am told to get off the blog because I’m spamming the feedback? o.O

    What, exactly, is this blog meant to be used for, please? Because my impression is that you may as well disable all comments and just use it for posting news, which isn’t really a blog, is it… Or not in the way I always understood blogs to work.

    I’m sick and tired of the whole thing and won’t be using this blog anymore. Expect you’ll all heave a sigh of relief anyway, since you don’t appreciate my positive comments – or even my giving presents – but are quick to condemn me when I am so depressed by the whole attitude of LL that I feel like quitting ๐Ÿ˜ฆ Except that I have paid for a year’s account in advance, so I can’t really, without losing my money.

    Cheers, and Out,
    Fledge.

  21. Michael Takakura says:

    Since we all inhabit the same one “world”… I like the idea of using SLT in everything SL.. client, posts, and forums.

    P.S… Hugs and high-fives all around to Torley and the other Lindens, Mentors, and Helpers =)

  22. Maria Scheflo says:

    Torley,
    A most excellent post. I almost feel bad for being one of those bitching yesterday, however, while the system is down, it is fun and relaxing to complain, so don’t take it personally.

    However!!!! I’ve been on this system for almost 3 months. I love it. I love it. Oh, did I say, I love it? But everytime I get ready to try to do more, we have one of these major outages and I debate why I am here. Bucky says the CTO needs to get out in front of this and I agree completely. There should be some major apologies coming out for another horrible patch NOW and there needs to be a clear schedule for what we can be fixed and when.

    Fledge also mentioned his disappointment on the comment about not complaining. We should complain, it is frankly amazing that you try at THIS point to quell this. Once things got working again, MAYBE then would be a good time for you to put out the “let’s keep it positive” comment. Now, we have nothing BUT complaints.

    Yes, I am VERY thankful for the hard work the Lindens are doing. YES, I love the game. NO, I am not going to quit. But, Lindens will need to either get a little thicker skinned or start hiring the right people to make sure these problems don’t happen in the first place. It is a sad state of affairs for all companies that as you grow, your team may need to change. There comes a time when the company needs to grow up. The time for Linden of old has now past. I know the company can grow and provide the service that is needed. I also know there will continue to be some pain until that happens. ๐Ÿ™‚ I know you can do it though.

    Best of luck Lindens.

  23. Cocoanut Koala says:

    Well, Torley, I appreciate your cheerfulness and positive outlook and don’t think anyone deserves the tragedies that you have had in your past.

    However – several suggestions, for the Blog in general:

    1. Make sure bloggers don’t post an entry about bad news, and then sign off with, “Cheers!”

    2. We can’t tell you what you don’t know because we don’t know (and can’t know) what you do know.

    3. Lindens deciding in advance what they “need” feedback on, and what they don’t, is kind of already not listening, know what I mean?

    4. If we knew how to improve SL rather than just tell you the problems we’re having (i.e., “bitching”), then we would be either applying for a job at SL or already working at a similar place.

    I can tell you I have packet loss out the wazoo, but I certainly can’t tell you what to do about it. (Except stop letting anyone into SL after 8k are on.)

    5. And to use packet loss as an example, I think one of the problems is while you and some of the other Lindens might be aware that it is a problem, WE can’t know you are aware, or working on it, unless you say so, and say so often.

    A poster earlier suggested that someone make announcements about this and other issues frequently, and I think that is a good idea. See, you just mentioned it here in this blog entry, and that is very reassuring.

    But not every resident reads every blog entry ever made, particularly since they quickly disappear down the page. So – saying people should stop talking or asking about it, since you ALREADY KNOW about it, is rather beside the point.

    The point is, residents need to know you know about it, know you are working on it, know HOW you are working on it, and hear that on on a frequent, updating basis.

    (In fact, there are Lindens themselves who still don’t have the news that this is a problem, and are offering advice as if it were confined to the resident’s own computer connection.)

    In other words, it isn’t enough for someone to tell you there is a problem three weeks ago Tuesday, and then you “know,” and then no one need discuss it ever again.

    What is important is that you keep communicating to the residents what THEY need to know, not vice-versa.

    coco

  24. Kilandra Yeuxdoux says:

    Torley

    All I can say is that you’re doing a great job. As are all of you Lindens are.

    I think of all of the hiccups, issues and everything that goes with it as growing spurts.

    Thanks for doing a great job and Happy Holidays!

  25. Rose Bradley says:

    Thank you Torley, I’ve always known you where the PR person.

    I have fault bad in the past when I see you in the trenches trying to buffer between the resendents and the Lindens. I hope LL is lucky to find someone half as good as you are to help you out.

    I think Torrid Midnight was correct, they should take what you have and bottle it up with all it’s pink and green goodness and sell it.

  26. Joel Savard says:

    Time is still an awful problem… Picking any *one* won’t satisfy everyone… Wouldn’t it be great to have an option to see the *local* time for people in their hover along with their name as an option? That way I know “oh, for the person I’m talking to it’s 5:00 even though here it is 22:00… Or maybe to list their current time on their profile to avoid adding hover text – or something to that effect? Or maybe to list their GMT offset and their local time at the moment somewhere? Just an idea…

  27. Joel Savard says:

    Ohh.. by “awful problem” I don’t mean to say it’s a huge problem in SL, but that the solution to global time is sticky in many, many ways for just about every system and environment…

  28. Chronic Skronski says:

    These guidelines are excellent, let’s hope that they will be acknowledged. The thread yesterday was a disaster – almost 1500 posts on only about three different topics, strippers hitting on other people in the thread, Linden bashing, illiterate poo-flinging, etc. The residents ruined their own thread by clogging it with so much garbage that anyone with new and meaningful feedback was just scrolled past. There were posts by people who admitted to not even reading the last 1499 posts and then complaining (not too constructively either) about the same thing that 327 people had already moaned about, just so their own name could be seen in the blog.

    Please people, take Torley’s advice. Screaming in the blogs is not helping anything and is just making it much worse. Don’t crap where you sleep.

  29. Earwig says:

    >

    Nope, this is still not up. I just tried it. I still cannot accept a partnership proposal that was sent to me. ๐Ÿ˜ฆ

  30. ^ Thanxies for the continued comments and encouragement! @Kilandria, feels like the holidays already here. Snowfall is heavy.

    (@Chronic, “don’t excrete where you sleep” rhymes better, mebbe it can be a song.)

    And:

    @Joel: That sounds like such an obviously good idea, I wonder if it’s already been done. To such ends, if anyone’s seen a WordPress plugin like that, please let me know ASAP.

    @Rose: Funniest irony (or not) is I’m not even PR! I’m not even Marketing, or Customer Service. Lemme tell ya, a lot of about this world is wacky to me. But… there is beauty. Trivia: one of my fave dresses is Torrid’s “Love Letter”, tinted watermeloney of course.

    And generally: just about every time I’ve been kicked in the avatar ass with a DAMN ANNOYING PROBLEM like many of you have, I’ve reported it to Lindens in the know, or if I didn’t have the time at the moment (because I was working on something else, depending on priority), I’ve entered it myself as an open issue. In the past, I’ve aggregated whole heaps of issues โ€” what really helps is looking for patterns, because time after time, just like human emotions… you see the same things.

    I believe I’m a positive person, but I temper that with being critical a lot (see my bug reports, gah). It is nice people see me as friendly rather than a jerk, but I hope for more credence to be given to when I am fault-finding, because I am.

    @coco: There sure are lots of important things which need frequent reminders, I’m with you on that. And I actually believe, there are a lot of factors which can never be obvious enough โ€” so better to overstate than understate. There’s always gonna be someone who says, “I didn’t hear about it!” That takes some fine judgment and I’m still learning, always will be.

    One of the things I struggle with most right now is information overload โ€” my inbox is swamped and there’s so many things which are ranked “really important”! I swear I need a freakin’ popurls for SL! Maybe I can highlight more of these critical issues using Widgets, since the sidebar doesn’t move down with new posts. *writes down idea*

    Re: constant topic of forums, as many know, I’m the most heavy user of the SL Forums ever. In the future I’d like to see more sites which break the conventional communications “roles”; I’d like to see Second Life be a part of that. Proof it’s happening: WetPaint.com, which is a hybrid wiki-blog-forum thing.

    @Maria: Being immersed to the diversity of Resis I am, I’ve heard numerous compliments in addition to the complaints. Great new features which are muddied up because of the problems. Sometimes it’s difficult for me to characterize things as “good” or “bad”, because they just are. Some call that cornball, but I say: if you learn from your mistakes, weren’t those mistakes ultimately a good thing, as embarrassing as they may have been? (And I’ve added my share.)

    Now the horrible thing comes when the same mistakes keep happening; I know in recent memories, releases have been dreaded because “something big goes wrong”. What often happens @ LL is there’s post-mortems with internal details, they get documented. What happened this time has similar symptoms that’ve caused problems before, but it wasn’t a redundant repeat. Beyond our deepest apologies, which I certainly feel, I vow to do my part to continue to identify “cracks” before things break apart.

    Time and time again, like textures, ๐Ÿ˜‰ it comes down to seamlessness: like the Apple philosophy, “it just works”. You want safety and security, odds are you have enough undesirable unpredictability in “RL”. Maybe you want a stability in Second Life you don’t have elsewhere, or at least, peace of mind. This is wholly consistent with our “building a better world”, and not just in the utopian sense either.

    I am many things at the same time, positive AND negative being one of the foremost. Let that stand for the record. And thank you for your patience (I know I say that 10x like a pinball multiplier) while we continue to hire and scale.

    @Fledge: To be clear, as it says on the Blog Guidelines page, We love connecting with our community and value tolerance and free expression!. That is not hot air, I have seen many criticisms about SL on this blog. I am sorry to hear this sounds like your last comment. But really, you should think better of yourself. There are many times I was gonna give up…

    @Bucky, you’re far from the only person who’s said this; CTO, you mean Cory, right? I will let him know.

    @Ultra… ooops that’s off-topic for here… I won’t delete you but Chadrick’s recent post is still open and related. Go for it.

    @StevenSDF; I think you have me beat with emoticons. ๐Ÿ˜€ ๐Ÿ˜€ ๐Ÿ˜€

    @Pointless โ€” sometimes that says more about the person making than the comment than the post they’re commenting on. I know it’ll happen anyway, but how someone reacts to a situation speaks loudly about their character, especially since there’ll continue to be many, many entries OPEN to comments. Just, not all of them. Isn’t variety the spice of life? And doesn’t Second Life have its own spices? To wit, I must admit I’m often looking out for creative trackbacks as extended comments to our blog, so perhaps an understated mainline here is:

    With entries with blog comments closed, let’s leave trackbacks/pings/pingbacks open.

    Observe what happens, reabsorb, adapt, learn from the knowledge of our people โ€” this could be you! โ€” and move on.

  31. Echo Folsom says:

    I doubt that UTC goes to Daylight Savings at the same time as the US. In fact, would someone please educate me: does UTC do Daylight Savings at all? I’m only pretty sure it doesn’t. So SLT is PST, but that is only UTC-8 for part of the year.

    Of course, we could use nautical time zones, which have all the advantages of changing with DST, and the additional advantage of being understood and used in normal practice by only a small percentage of people. More info here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timezone#Nautical_time_zones

  32. Erbo says:

    Torley, I know you’re doing the best you can. So let me at least help make the burden a little easier to carry by telling you about a couple of things that have gone right.

    The IM “typing…” indicators and emotes are perfect, and help bring SL’s IM system forward into the 21st century. And I know my friend Vertex Zenith would be pleased to see that the emotes are finally there…Vert, this cowbell’s for you!

    Also, I’m impressed with the sophistication of the new Friends List display, and the automatic IM and chat logs work as advertised. Though I wish the timestamps carried over into the log files…but it’s a small matter. And the “Web” tab in the profile is, of course, the shiznit; you can now access Evans Avenue Exit directly through my profile. ๐Ÿ™‚

    So be comforted; it’s an ill wind indeed that doesn’t blow some good.

  33. @Erbo, well I have some more good news for you! ๐Ÿ™‚ We know about the timestamps-not-showing up thing, it’s a bug. Will be fixed in 1.13.1.

    I’ll also share your comments with the Linden devs responsible for these excellent things!

    That reminds me, I gotta work on my web profile.

    Sage words indeed, thank-you.

  34. Earwig says:

    Torley, while there have been some glitches, which are not unusual, I agree with Erbo, the enhancements to Friends and IM are fantastic, as are some of the bug fixes.

    My one desire, would be to see the blog entry corrected that says that the partnerships page is working, since it still is not (just verified that a minute ago). Or at least that someone is looking into ahy accepting proposals does not work.

    Overall, good work, and I hope you guys keep it up.

  35. Sargent says:

    Partnering doesn’t work still. My gal can’t reply to my proposal.

  36. Hey Earwig, right on…

    I just tested a Partnership and it went through for me; I got the expected:

    You have received a Second Life partner proposal from Torley Linden.
    Please visit the link below to view the proposal:

    Can you please verify that you’re logged in as the desired account and double-check that you checked the right email box it was sent to?

    If it’s giving you an error message, please say so.

    We indeed had several Lindens looking at this earlier; if there are more problems we should know the specifics ASAP so we can update.

    And thanx! ๐Ÿ™‚

  37. Earwig says:

    Torley, Yes, I’m logged in as the desired account, no, it did not request an e-mail account, nor was there an error message. I click “I Accept”, and it returns to the same page, with my acceptance text gone. If I click to refuse, that goes through just fine (my future partner and I did that as a test earlier). It really is that simple. We even tried turning around the proposal, and it behaved the same.

  38. K, I’m digging deeper on this! Thanx for the info, Earwig and Sargent.

  39. Rosie Simca says:

    Yay! I love Second Life and all its up and downs!!! Way to be!

  40. Earwig says:

    Torley, I sent you an IM in SL with more information on the proposal that is not working for me and my partner. Hope that helps.

  41. Oh rats! Sowwies, IMs are flaky for me… I get way too many, hard to manage, sometimes my IM-to-email gets turned off mysteriously (maybe all the crazy testing I do :p) and my msgs get capped, etc.

    Like it says in my profile: please email me with the info!

    [EDIT] Lucky, I got yours! Thx for the example.

  42. Trilobite Reisman says:

    Sigh. GMT. PST. Can we have SLT/PST on all the pages of the SL site? I get so cunfused, especially since SL broke my bodyclock and right about now i’m in insomniac miasma.

    I’m gonna make a SL t-shirt that says “It’s not my fault your day is my night.”

  43. Trilobite Reisman says:

    Thinking clockwise…… I seem to rememeber Phantasy Star Online using that hilarious Swatch beat time – which would be great in SL if you had your own local time next to it so you could get used to what possible time of day 1337 might be.

    Maybe some kind of global SL timethang is in order? It’d be a lot more sci-fi and otherworldly and metaversal if our clocks didn’t run in minutes, but ran in, say, potatoes.

    For all else that’s afoot, i’m noticing my poor cog-grinding pre-intel macmini now rezzes the world about 3x faster since the update and ironing out of crunchy bits. Dunno what y’all did, but….. nice.

    It’s really not my fault your day is my night, though.

  44. SignpostMarv says:

    Note: I intended to post this about 4 hours ago or something. Got distracted ๐Ÿ™‚

    Luciftias

    My own preferred strategy of devising elaborate Auric Goldfinger style traps for my childhood G.I. Joe toys is wearing a bit thin.

    Don’t you mean Rube Goldberg ?

    Mark Barrett

    I really liked the made up SLT. Of course in the end itโ€™s all the same.

    So do I, but sneaking SLT into WordPress would be a pain.

    etherkye Hansen

    theres only 24 time zones, canโ€™t be that bad XD

    Unfortunately for me, there are considerably more.

    Torley

    On chronology: drives me crazy, can we go Swatch beats already?

    The problem with Swatch beats is that it would drive everyone to have a local offset to global time, instead of the more convenient global offset to local time.

    Pointless

    Itโ€™s pointless closing comments – people just leave their comments on the last post that has open comments anyway.

    By all means encourage constructive criticism and discourage unnecessary bitching etc., but donโ€™t close comments – it makes you look like you are too arrogant to care what residents think.

    Linden Lab employees are not paid to be masochists, so they should not forced to be put through unfocussed, non-constructive criticism, mindless bitching etc and still be expected to put on a smiley face. Some topics do not need commenting on. Old ones that degenerate into off-topic rants are obviously past discussion.

    Closing blog threads is appropriate, and should be done.

    Ultra Nefarious

    Since all the other blogs are now closed to comment, I find myself in the probably incorrect position of putting this comment here.

    Please use the forum or support lines as directed instead of the blog.

    Fledhyris Proudhon

    No comment threading or tag features.

    This is the nature of a default WordPress install.

    I am so depressed by the whole attitude of LL that I feel like quitting

    >huggles<

    Maria Scheflo

    Fledge also mentioned his disappointment on the comment about not complaining.

    As taken from her profile: I’m a dragoness

    Once things got working again, MAYBE then would be a good time for you to put out the โ€œletโ€™s keep it positiveโ€ comment. Now, we have nothing BUT complaints.

    The problem is that people tend to complain about issues that are entirely irrelevant to the blog post, which puts people off from discussing the issues at hand.

    Cocoanut Koala

    Lindens deciding in advance what they โ€œneedโ€ feedback on, and what they donโ€™t, is kind of already not listening, know what I mean?

    If you go to a doctor, do you tell them about your cat’s illness or your own ?

    A blog post is made about a specific issue, and in the context of that blog post all else is irrelevant.

    What is important is that you keep communicating to the residents what THEY need to know, not vice-versa.

    While that is a good point, other than the town hall meetings, and perusing the forums, and the mailing lists (all of which are difficult to use or find useful information on) I don’t think Linden Lab have made a blog post for “what would you like to know” yet. That kind of question, because there are at least 800 thousand of us (flexible estimate on non-alts) and a blog thread would become unmanagble to read, would be best posed in the form of a closed-comments blog post linked to a forum thread- basically creating a more high profile version of the mailing list for the town hall questions.

    Rose Bradley

    I think Torrid Midnight was correct, they should take what you have and bottle it up with all itโ€™s pink and green goodness and sell it.

    What Torley has is watermelony goodness. Now the actual quote was:
    Torrid Midnight

    We need to bottle whatever it is that Torley… has or is on, and sell that s*** cos it would just make a f****** fortunte. See everything in neon pink and green and just.. woooo!

    Taken from SecondCast Episode 45 @ around 55:52.

    Joel Savard

    Time is still an awful problemโ€ฆ Picking any *one* wonโ€™t satisfy everyoneโ€ฆ Wouldnโ€™t it be great to have an option to see the *local* time for people in their hover along with their name as an option?

    If you’re referring to an in-world thing, the current solution would be to use your first-life profile to list your UTC offset if you’re not comfortable with listing your country. I’m working on a future evil-plan to combine with the current project that I shall elect to not plug ๐Ÿ™‚

    Chronic Skronski

    The residents ruined their own thread by clogging it with so much garbage that anyone with new and meaningful feedback was just scrolled past.

    Echo Folsom

    does UTC do Daylight Savings at all?

    UTC is not a timezone system. it is an offset mechanism. Timezones are “offset from” UTC.

    Torley

    I am sorry to hear this sounds like your last comment.

    I’m sure I can cheer Fledge up, if at least only to the point where she will leave a comment telling me off for ranting too furiously ๐Ÿ™‚

    Earwig

    Torley, I sent you an IM in SL with more information on the proposal that is not working for me and my partner. Hope that helps.

    Torley

    Like it says in my profile: please email me with the info!

    Seriously, emailing Torley is good way to go. Torley has an unbelievably high turnaround time for someone so popular ๐Ÿ™‚

  45. SignpostMarv says:

    Trilobite Reisman

    Thinking clockwiseโ€ฆโ€ฆ I seem to rememeber Phantasy Star Online using that hilarious Swatch beat time – which would be great in SL if you had your own local time next to it so you could get used to what possible time of day 1337 might be.

    Maybe some kind of global SL timethang is in order? Itโ€™d be a lot more sci-fi and otherworldly and metaversal if our clocks didnโ€™t run in minutes, but ran in, say, potatoes.

    &ltselfpimpage>already done. If you’re wanting a clock for any timezone, I can hook you up with one, or give you the API scripts to play with making your own :-)&lt/selfpimpage>

  46. Eric Rice says:

    A few of us were chattering offline that Linden Lab needs a Scoble.

    We found the prodigy! Keep it up Torley, you’re gonna be the resident Scoblemelon, and it might be just what LL needs.

  47. Elizabeth Winnfield says:

    Here’s an idea I haven’t yet seen…and would dearly love to see (in relation to timezonese)…why not have the current SL time displayed on the login screen – so we can check the SL time in relation to an event without having to login.

    Yeah I know – wrong spot to suggest it, off topic…but there is sooo much discussion about timezones in this blog, and I have been dieing to say this to someone, anyone, for ages…

  48. Cocoanut Koala says:

    Well, now that I think about it, it is a waste of time for me to post my suggestions here, or anyone else, really.

    After all, SignPost Marv has all the answers. I think you should give him the ability to post his own blog entries! He could just turn comments off, and save himself the trouble of batting aside everyone else’s points.

    coco

  49. Torley, don’t forget that whilst you and a few Lindens might like the blog format because it’s “different” to how most other online games communicate with their players, many people would still prefer to have a decent, full set of forums that actually allow the players to decide what we talk about, rather than being restricted to the few subjects you choose, sanitised by the Love Machine, to make it look as though all is well.

    Broccoli

  50. Alex Warrior says:

    G’day

    Great work Linden Lab marketing!

    You had a MAJOR public relations problem in these blogs and it’s a perfect way to handle it by encouraging Torley to post, post and post some more.

    She’s lovely and she mediates things perfectly and because she is “not in marketing” it’s sincere.

    Good work Torley and good work Linden Lab management for encouraging her to placate the masses.

    Cheers
    Alex Warrior
    aka Janine Au

  51. MM says:

    ty for the info Torley! can I quote you on this without the context? … “So, you gotta lot of choices, and one of them is: instead of bitching, please help us improve Second Life for you.” =P

  52. Stephe Erhler says:

    Yea my partner proposal wouldn’t go through either. She got it but the message but it won’t take.. ๐Ÿ˜ฆ

  53. StevenSDF Fisher says:

    > @StevenSDF; I think you have me beat with emoticons. ๐Ÿ˜€ ๐Ÿ˜€ ๐Ÿ˜€

    Ah, sometimes I have to stop myself from using too many. XD

    For some reason it tends to annoy others :p

    OMGTEHSMILIEFLOOD ๐Ÿ˜ฎ :p ๐Ÿ™‚

    I like how this thing has gone totally OT ๐Ÿ˜€

  54. Brandon says:

    Sign-
    The moderators were happy to see Coco leave the TSO stratics forums also.
    Enough said.

  55. Pingback: MMODump.com » Hey! What happened to my comment?

  56. John Horner says:

    The “Big Issue” in posting to a BB is how are other people going to react to your post. I learned that craft in 2002/3 when I had to resort to stock market share BBs to find out what the **** was happening to the markets when people were loosing their jobs, life savings, and in some cases going to war, and nobody on the inside would give you a straight answer. If anyone is interested review some old (and current) threads on http://www.advfn.com for everyday examples.

    Linden labs “issues” pale into insignificance compared with those days.

    So I have two tips for a stress free BB life.

    1) Never post if you are having a bad day with external unconnected issues as human nature dictates you will want to “take it out” on someone

    2) Always cut and paste into Word (or similar) and reread the post before hitting the send button, there have been many times when I have posted and have done that, and on reflection deleted the Word Document BB post.

    No disrespect intended

    Regards

    John

  57. Sargent says:

    How is the partnering thing looking Torley?

  58. Thank you for each and all continued thoughtful comments…

    @Trilobite (I like trilobites!), we usually state timezones on pages with time-related info. I know the Events page is missing them, and inworld it still says “PDT” instead of “PST” for Events. Open issue to be fixed.

    @Marv: Good lord, quotemaster you! Thanks, now I know where Torrid said that.

    @Eric: Thanx! That’s really an honor, esp. coming from such a veteran of the field as you! ๐Ÿ™‚ Hrmmm mebbe we should have more multimedia here, just like Scoble has his video show! Like one of the 9rules goes, “Respect your inspiration”, and Scoble inspires me. He’s got the #1 WordPress blog after all!

    @Elizabeth: Login screen does display PST time in the upper-right!

    @Broccoli: Yup, esp. since I am historically a forum fiend myself. Lots of Resident-run forums are arising, however โ€” no LL “sanitization” there. Big future hope for me: post-forums (I mentioned WetPaint earlier). Too much forum software is samey, I want more mold-breakers, not for la revolution cause, but because as Second Life itself shows… more, better ways to communicate, always.

    @Alex: Well that’s really nice of you! ๐Ÿ™‚ I don’t really know what “placating the masses” is all about, I just say stuff and react like any good Stephen King everyman being assaulted by night terrors. I assure you our marketing isn’t insincere tho!

    @MM: Yes, quote that as much as you like.

    Re: partnering thing, I updated right here.

    Thanks for all the the warmth, especially because it’s so (literally) cold. It’s 5 AM PST here and I’m eating Irish Stew. The snow outside is very fierce. I fell in earlier when trying to get the mail, and made snow angels. I’m crazy like that.

  59. Maria Scheflo says:

    @SignPost Marv: What an impressive list of comments.

    @Flex: My apologies Hun. That will teach me for assuming.

    @Torley: Thank you so much for your comments hun. Also major thanks for the increased communications this time around. I’m seeing the blog updated often with latest status and I’m seeing a lot of in world communications. This is awesome. Just the right steps needed. LIke I said, I knew Linden could make it to the next level. We keep seeing those signs that you are making it. ๐Ÿ™‚ Keep up the progress and the move to the next level. Don’t worry about the negative comments, just remember they are us reminding you the direction to go. We love the game and things are getting better.

    Most important, thanks for getting the system stable enough that I could have my first event last night. It was awesome. Who ever thought you could have a wet t-shirt contest and make it look realistic. Will definitely have to do that again.

  60. @Torley: I know I’d be interested in seeing some of the patch post-mortem results… I doubt I’m the only res here interested in seeing the process as well as the product.

  61. Cerulia Moxie says:

    I’m sorry if this isn’t quite on topic, but that is a very snazzy picture at the end of the blog post there Torley! That’s not straight from SL is it? I never knew a plywood cube could look so good!

  62. Adam Spark says:

    I hope this isn’t a rehashed idea, but I have an idea that might take care of the time zone issue.

    Link all time stamps on the blogs and web page (in-world would be nice too, if possible) to the following:

    http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/full.html?&sort=1

    World time map, sorted by country.

  63. @Adam: I really like that world clock page, I’ve used it myself in previous updates. Let me add that as a blog to-do. In the meantime, I think I can also include it as a Widget on the right.

    @Storm: I’ve let CTO of Linden Lab, Cory Linden, know how interested Resis are in getting more technical details about what happened and where we’re going with Second Life. Maybe we can get a technical Town Hall put together, let’s see!

    @Cerulia: Hehe totally okay to ask, it’s part of the post after all. When I have time, I do SL-related art. That was a shot out of SL, with some blur added. Nothing extravagant, but I thought it was romantic to see a plywood cube in moonlight. On second thought, two cubes would be even more lovely.

    @Maria: Thanx for sharing this with us, I’ve felt the same way about “negative comments” before too.

  64. Cocoanut Koala says:

    Brandon, I have no idea what you are talking about. The TSO moderators were my friends, half of them, and asked me many times to help moderate there.

    coco

  65. britney benford says:

    since this has nothing to do with this thread, i know that, but since LL has decided to stop comments on the pertinent topics, i’m posting it here. I am a paying customer, and that means that LL has taken my money for their service. I understand that the code for SL is extremely complex. I understand that there are literally Thousands of servers that need the new code. I understand that the Codemonkey’s work long hours for each update…
    BUT WILL SOMEONE PLEASE EXPLAIN WHY EVERY UPDATE THAT GOES THROUGH IS 4-5 DAYS BEFORE EVERYTHING IS STABLE, AND EVEN THEN ONLY AFTER AN EMERGENCY PATCH, I MEAN OPTIONAL VIEWER….
    if i were a cable tv company and this sort of thing happened, where every 2 weeks, my customers got better reception over their antenna’s for 5 days, i’d be out of business fast. It isn’t worth all the “new features” when teh core program goes to hell. I personally could care less about new splash scrrens, and new “website” in profile, when i can’t even get a search to connect reliably, nor are places searchable for. LL IS TURNING INTO AOL OF THE MID 90’S!!!!!!! you are caring more about flash and glitz, and press than you established subscriber base. AOL is no longer what they are, and they are now a totally free service. FOCUS on your core!!!!!!!

  66. John Horner says:

    I will say that the AOL comment is very relevant indeed.

    On the one hand my news feeds are becoming overwhelmed with SL news, today for example I hear that ABN AMRO the investment and merchant bank are setting up in SLโ€ฆ.(source Reuters)

    On the other hand Gov Linden together with the Linden Labs team do seem to have the ability to snatch one last spectacular defeat from the jaws of impending victory.

    Focus on the core, by that I mean speech and a web page on a prim.

    Regards

    John

  67. NickCA Dittmann says:

    re: ABN AMRO

    1. Beware the Linden being designated as a currency. Only the US government can create (out of thin air) currency. Please be careful – a lot of activities seem to be in the grey zone. e.g. external exchanges of Lindens into USD or other currencies. I was particularly disturbed to hear Philip’s comments at the last town hall meeting about acting like a central bank (hope he does it better than Greenspan – we are about to enjoy his legacy). If there were zero spillover into RL, this might be ok, but as things stand now, I hope you have expert advice on all things L$ related.

    2. ABN AMRO and other RL firms entering SL will have even HIGHER expectations than current residents. Please also keep that well in mind. You don’t want to see the headline on CNET: “IBM pulls out of Second Life.” Think of residents as very helpful PROXIES for how well you are doing with respect to corporate entities establishing themselves here. If it is getting screwed up for the residents, it has high level visibility at Adidas, Reebok, Toyota, Nissan, IBM, Harvard University, Starwood Hotels, Dell, Sony, Reuters and others. Anyone at those firms can grab a free account, read the blogs, experience for themselves the wonders of disappearing islands (hey, that could be ours!) etc.

    Re Cory: I would love to see a TOP 5 ISSUES post every single day listing them, indicating what has been done or tried in the last day, what is being done (“working on it” doesn’t cut it), what Cory believes the current status to be and, as appropriate, an ETA for a fix. (hours, one day, several day, couple weeks?). This post need not be commentable. Town hall approach would, I’m sure, degenerate rapidly into a poo slinging contest.

    Thanks for the good work here Torley.

    Nick

  68. Just a thought says:

    Considering that any blog updates ahead of this one really do not have much relevance to what I am going to say, and that this one seems to be a catch-all I would like to point something out to anyone in world right now having issues:

    If for any reason the display of all profile information is not occuring no matter who you view (more than just the name!) DO NOT LOG OUT AND BACK IN. It only makes it worse. In fact if you go to the prefs. section of edit and hit Communication you’ll see that the server thinks you’re offline ….

    Until the profiles display, as far as the system is concerned you are not online. reloging does not fix this as I discovered last night (seven relog attempts, got in world and everything was worse – not better.)

  69. SignpostMarv says:

    Cocoanut Koala

    After all, SignPost Marv has all the answers. I think you should give him the ability to post his own blog entries! He could just turn comments off,

    From the way WordPress’s permissions system works, I’d need to be given Admin level perms to switch comments off, but only contributor level perms in order to make posts ๐Ÿ˜›

    and save himself the trouble of batting aside everyone elseโ€™s points.

    Yeah….. I get accused of being an arogant sod, but you expect to let people just run free without any intelligent opposition (as opposed to ZOMG LL IS TEH SUXXOR) ? Don’t be ridiculous.

    Torley Linden

    Nothing extravagant, but I thought it was romantic to see a plywood cube in moonlight. On second thought, two cubes would be even more lovely.

    You been map stalking Cube Linden ?

    NickCA Dittmann

    Only the US government can create (out of thin air) currency.

    Any government recognised by the citizenry of a nation can create (out of thin air). Other governments need only recognised the government, and by extension, the currency for it to have any worth outside of a nation.

    Which is why you have situations where the citizenry of a poorly managed economy will ignore the currency their government provides and uses someone else’s currency. This happens almost as much in the digital world as it does in the physical world- third world countries using the US Dollar for an ad-hoc economy, people selling gold on eBay, challenging the validity of the L$…..

    I would love to see a TOP 5 ISSUES post every single day listing them, indicating what has been done or tried in the last day, what is being done (โ€working on itโ€ doesnโ€™t cut it), what Cory believes the current status to be and, as appropriate, an ETA for a fix. (hours, one day, several day, couple weeks?).

    I would prefer to see a bugzilla installation so bug tracking and reporting (and thus, whining) is separate from the blog.

  70. Jamie David says:

    Quote “As of now, 7,777 spam caught since we moved to WordPress VIP.)”

    That is false stats. Before WorldPress there were no problems with spam as all had to be registered. What WorldPress gives is control and censorship. No comments allowed on how many postings?

    Jamie

    Wonders how many legitimate postings got eaten by a formula.

  71. Harvey says:

    Just on the off topic conversations, Chadrick told off a couple of people for off comment posts when they were criticising something but said nothing about people posting to flirt with him or pat him on the back which is also off topic. I know the latter made him feel good but a little consistency would probably avoid many of the problems.

    But (hopes it’s not too off topic)

    I think Chadrick did a great job informing the community and taking comments on bugs and I think LL did a very good job getting most of LL back to a working state after the upgrade so I’d like to say that what Chadrick did publicly on the blog and what LL did internally was very much appreciated at least by myself

    @Marv, I’ve seen you go off topic quite a lot, usually answering someone else thats off topic but never the less, I go off topic too so I’m not trying to tell you off here except that I think in an earlier post you were telling others off.

    Much of the whining I think comes from the blog being the only place that it can be done that most people know about, it might not make LL feel the best but it’s their customers and a lot of it should be listened to, perhaps not taken to heart which is hard to do and generally just becomes an emotional drain, but if a company has 1500 odd complaints in an hour or two, they need to take notice at some level.

  72. SignpostMarv says:

    Jamie David

    That is false stats. Before WorldPress there were no problems with spam as all had to be registered. What WorldPress gives is control and censorship. No comments allowed on how many postings?

    You speak as someone who has never had a WordPress blog.

    This blog is open to public commenting. That means anyone who has access to the internet can post comments.

    Including those who are just CLI SPAM bots.

    Just checking over the Akismet stats on my blogs:

    2235 articles of SPAM caught.

    228 currently viewable (they get permanently deleted after 30 days)

    Considering that the Linden Blog is substantially higher profile than my own, and they’ve only got about 3 times as much spam as I have, I- and anyone else who uses Akismet knows it isn’t a false statistic ๐Ÿ™‚

  73. SignpostMarv says:

    Also, before WordPress ? Linden Lab haven’t ever used anything other than WordPress.

    Also note that when Linden Lab were hosting the WordPress install themselves, they hadn’t gotten around to merging the registration database…..

    So no clue where you’re getting that thing about having to be registered from.

  74. Pingback: Miscellot ยซ Torley Lives

  75. Just a thought says:

    torley, I don’t know if you’re still reading this or not but I have a suggestion for cutting down on flaming and trolling.

    delete any and all comments made suggesting alterations to the free Accounts in Second Life.

    That is the most heavily debated topic and quite frankly the people complaining know they’re going to get an angry response.

  76. Melissavp Islander says:

    Dear all,

    On topic, I have used the event list to go around or asked friends to tp me where ever they were.

    Off topic about freebees, I am one and just remember time is money, I bring my time, wit and creativity to earn my L$ so I can shop around and I am sure some of those came from the exchange (bringing real $ into play), that is what I bring to the experience. Even in real life one is not born with a stack of gold under the bed. One creates value again participating creatively in the society. Lets hope things get better, see ya in SL

  77. Fledhyris Proudhon says:

    I’m sorry, I’m going to post again – Torley and Marv at least want me here *G* (And thanks Marv, yes everyone, Fledge is a she *G*) You just can’t keep a dragon down.

    Incidentally, before I carry on, very well done LL on efforts made to rescue this week’s update fiasco. Let’s all hope it doesn’t happen again ๐Ÿ™‚ By which I mean, let’s all hope you’re implementing steps to ensure it won’t. If nothing else though, it’s made for some very entertaining discussions with friends recently away from SL, and I think it’s knocked the whole copybot issue right into the discard tray!

    Now, about the purpose of this blog, and whether free discussion is welcome or not. Here are the stated guidelines: “The goal of this blog is to create a complex, nuanced, civil discussion. Comments will be posted when they contribute by adding information, opinions and ideas. Negative or contrary opinions are welcome as long as they donโ€™t violate the common rules of netiquette.”

    Yet I see people being snubbed, time and again, by other residents AND Lindens – merely for posting, politely, their own thoughts and responses and even constructive suggestions – just because the comments have started to run to triple figures and everyone is feeling a bit heated by untoward events, or because “we’ve all heard it before”.

    Please try to remember, everyone, that people contribute to this blog *because they care*. Sometimes all of us could do with sitting back a bit and taking a few deep breaths before we comment, and I’m no better than anyone else in that regard. But don’t ignore anyone just because they are complaining, even when they do sound a bit snippy. I’d say that 99% of the material I read in this blog is *not* mere unconstructive bitching, and is *not* off topic. People make salient points, where they can make them, and in line with the thread of previous comments. And they helpfully answer one another when questions are asked – which incidentally takes the load off the posting Linden’s back! That’s what a “complex, nuanced, civil discussion” actually means.

    I do understand that it must be depressing for the Lindens to read about our frustrations with the platform. But then again, you know we’re only frustrated because we love it so much and we want it to work as much as you do, and sometimes it looks as though some people at LL just aren’t listening to common sense (not that we know your secret policy agenda >.> ) and so we want to shout out the message to drive it home. Please don’t take our rantings personally. Take them as the supportive contribution to SL we intend ๐Ÿ™‚

    And are you still investigating items that have gone missing from parcels since the update..? I have a very sad friend who is missing his sexgen rug (don’t anyone dare laugh ยฌยฌ) and I told him to submit a detailed bug report. I hope that will bear positive results.

  78. Snacks Waki says:

    >> The first time you ever make a comment here, it will be held in our moderation queue until we can manually approve it

  79. I’m here. =^_^=

    I’m not usually a strict person and won’t cane you for a single off-topic comment; fun is alright. I resonate with patterns tho (think “What if Cayce Pollard blogged?”).

    I don’t intend for us to delete all the comments on a single topic, nor to be machines. Sure, a little overhang there, met with some tightness over there. It balances out, since this blog isn’t all laffs nor all_serious.exe.

    Thanx SignpostMarv for answering many questions here, you’re a big help!

    Fledhyris, well-said, and maybe that’s too biased of me, because I’ve said a lot of the same things before: when someone is taking part of their life, time they realize they’ll never get back, to come here and invest in writing a long, thought-out comment, it sure does say they care. Passionate people do passionate things.

    I should clarify we โ€” I personally don’t โ€” snub comments just because a thread’s gotten long and there’s heat. But long threads are harder to follow. They have more words to read. And just as I’ve seen in the forums, are more prone to negative redundancy. In other words, the same mistakes made over and over. Of course, we tend to delete of the “unconstructive bitching”, so that’s why you don’t see it.

    I believe it’s simpler to say “I care” than vent angrily, however!

    Are you (meant generally) frustrated? Say so, don’t attack personally. Because if you want Lindens to improve, set a good example. Show us what to strive for, what you want in your world.

    It’s good, pure, and true. ๐Ÿ™‚

  80. Jamie David says:

    For Mary:
    Prior to this wacked out system that sort of gives information but fustrates to the max, anyone trying to find out the situation used the forums. So there was very little spam as all accounts were known.

    Yes I do know WorldPress. It is not a solution for talking to customers. It is a solution for passing blogs and PR and in this case a flaming ball that just gets bigger. To say WorlPress’s filtering system caught 7000 spam and isnt that neat. Is PR hype. PreSL’s venture into WorldPress it was not an issue.

    How many times I have come here to post a comment that something is broke and been unable to start posting, unable to place a comment on a posting that is relevent or even find a posting that is relevent.

    With the SL world in a mess after the latest update. How does Linden Labs expect to hear from thier customers? Nice quiet messages “Hey by the way you know that …… is broke” with some me 2’s after. Not at the moment. They so fustrated by the time they post leave a thermo nuuuuclear bomb.

    *shrugs*

  81. Jamie David says:

    Dear lass O Watermellon
    Thank you for your posting on trying to stay on topic. It is nice to know that there is someone out there in the patch listening. It just seems to this seed that you are the only one and sadly your name is not Robin, Philip or Zee.

    “Are you (meant generally) frustrated? Say so, donโ€™t attack personally. Because if you want Lindens to improve, set a good example. Show us what to strive for, what you want in your world.”

    YES YES YES.

    Please as many have asked over and over and over. Stop adding new things. Fix the base code. Make the system stable. The rates went up. The service went down and now for over 50% of the day one can’t build, move about, host events that people can find and get to.

    Come to the bloggs and is there help? Is there timely information to better plan the day. No there is a battle going on between those Defending and attacking SL. Now it is easy to say “well it is all the residents fault” they do not want to be civil. I feel that that rage is out of fustration from a lack of communication, a visible lack of concern and inability to express it where one feels that it will be heard.

    My 2 seeds with out a scream.

  82. Jamie David says:

    Opps sorry Marv typo. Didn’t mean to call you Mary.. ๐Ÿ™‚
    Another reason why the forums are easier one can edit out typos and flames.

  83. SignpostMarv says:

    @Jamie David:

    How many times I have come here to post a comment that something is broke and been unable to start posting, unable to place a comment on a posting that is relevent or even find a posting that is relevent.

    As people keep noting, this is not a venue for tech support or bug reportage.

    Opps sorry Marv typo. Didnโ€™t mean to call you Mary

    It happens every now and then, don’t worry about it ๐Ÿ˜›

    Another reason why the forums are easier one can edit out typos and flames.

    If you wish to complain about the lack of a comment preview and editing feature, go complain to Automattic, not Linden Lab.

  84. Jamie David says:

    I still fail to see why we need this at all over the forums. There was no need to reinvent the wheel and make it square. I see a wonderful use for WorldPress and this is not it.

    This is the place according to thousands of postings by lindens to keep up to date. The Forums were too volitile and this was the replacement. The replacement is FUSTRATION. No one bothers with forums much any more, we were told to go away. So here we are were we are told to be.

    I understand why. It limits what can be talked about. But that seems to have failed as Residents post where ever they now feel that they will be heard. On top of that there is this spam. So many postings off topic because where else is there to talk about it.

    As to The Tech support, I have to dissagree. This is where Lindens post what they are doing on updates and upgrades. When there is an issue with that it is logical to post it where the original posting is. Like wise with bugs if it is to do with latest update. If they do not want us to talk to them then close down comments all together so that there is a unified location for support, information and news.

    Let the blog be the news postings of the Lindens, sort of like what they are doing with the front page of the client.

    I know it is a big deal for the Lindens to get thier postings to be seen above all the chatter but it seems a misdirection of efforts to those struggling in world that this is a good thing. End of the day we are all fustrated with the current trials that SL is going through. Dealing with the blog and comments is in my humble opinion hurting matters not helping. The signals it sends are confuseing at best, infutiating at worst.

  85. Billi Bisiani says:

    Yeahh!
    Hey-what-happened-to my comment???
    Yes what happened, how do I find it again after you have moderated it:
    “The first time you ever make a comment here, it will be held in our moderation queue until we can manually approve it”
    Okay you call it moderation, I know its censorship
    Uou say you want free speech, free expression, like to hear our opinion etc. etc.
    That is a lot of Bullshit! Because things never show after moderation…
    Is this the 3. Reich or DDR? or what is it, Sir Linden Governor????

  86. SignpostMarv says:

    @Billi Bisiani:

    Okay you call it moderation, I know its censorship
    Uou say you want free speech, free expression, like to hear our opinion etc. etc.
    That is a lot of Bullshit! Because things never show after moderationโ€ฆ
    Is this the 3. Reich or DDR? or what is it, Sir Linden Governor????

    And I call it “That’s how WordPress works“.

    1) You’ve never made a comment before, and you go to make a comment and hit the submit button.
    2) Akismet runs over your comment, and either puts it in the spam queue or puts it in the moderation queue. If you’ve made successful posts before, and WordPress does not say your comment is awaiting moderation and it has just gone poof, email the support department- that’s how I got my big-ass bbCode to HTML comparison comment posted. They’ll either find it in the Akismet queue (false positives), or ask you to repost the comment and IM/email them straight away if you don’t see it come up)
    3) A Blogmonkey will come across your comment in the moderation queue, and approve it.
    4) All future comments from that email address will be approved, and unless you’re like me you won’t have problems with WordPress making your comments go poof.

  87. Ah, I’ve just come across this entry today… it makes me think of several issues.

    Back in the old and forgotten days of USENET News and BBSes, we had Netiquette. One would assume that everybody posting to those bulletin boards knew the rules and abided by them; although, obviously, many choose to ignore them โ€” mostly deliberately.

    There is a lot of philosophical thought behind the way people write things once they are given the freedom to write them. It is also a cultural thing โ€” some cultures, groups (like age groups), and even social classes, tend only to rant and write negative feedback, others think that a civil way of discussion is far more constructive and leading to a successful outcome.

    Individually, there is no question that, no matter what your culture/group/class/country is, ultimately what will determine the way you write is the attitude you have towards others. Put into other words: what is more important to you, your rights or the rights of others? That will be the more important question to answer once you start writing a post, and, as said, it’s an issue of personal morals, your ethical standpoint, and your philosophy of life.

    The old Netiquette rules were based on the view that the rights of everybody are more important than the rights of the individual. This might seem a contradiction in terms; but, actually, that’s how our modern societies work! We evolved socially to protect the group by disallowing that someone’s rights are “more important” than others. This, in essence, leads to the difficult question: if I have freedom to express myself as I like (and that is supposed to be an unalienable right), why can’t I insult others or be rude as I want?

    The issue here is assuming a false premise: that “civility” (in the sense of “not being rude”) limits your freedom of expression somehow. Actually, the reverse is true. You can google for it โ€” constraints actually enhance creativity (you need to devise ways to overcome the limitations), not stifle it. However, too many constraints might ultimately crush the drive to creativity. And writing is, indeed, not much but the application of creativity to a specific medium.

    This also means that it takes a certain amount of skill, talent, and cleverness to write a very “insulting” and “negative” post, without ever crossing the line of civility. It is not easy to do. Like not everyone in Second Life is able to build amazing structures, or write a LSL script that does incredible things โ€” since all people have different levels of talent and skill to do so โ€” it’s also not easy to write a post that is not blunt, sticks to the point, and is a serious criticism. However, like we all can learn how to build and script (even if we might lack the talent to do works of art), we can all learn how to write in a civil way โ€” and still make our point.

    I do agree, however, that this is not something for everybody. In the pre-Internet days, writers were professionals โ€” they wrote for newspapers and books, and had editors to oversee their work. This is why a professionally-written article complaining about something in earnest, on a newspaper, looks completely different from a blog entry basically stating the same thing. No matter how much we wish to push the issue under the carpet, it’s a fact of life that trained professionals do write much better than amateurs. And they can be as insulting and destructive as they like โ€” while being civil at the same time. It’s something you can learn โ€” but not something that everybody has learned.

    There is no easy way to impose a professional style on a public forum/blog on the Internet, however. One can set up rules and codes of conducts. However, many will complain because those rules and codes might be interfering with your freedom of expression.

    This is not so. Freedom of expression only entitles you to the right to write as you please; it doesn’t entitle you to an audience. Like Torley correctly pointed out above, the Internet is the ultimate tool to enhance your freedom of expression, because everybody can create a blog (or forum). There are no limitations and the cost is virtually zero โ€” unlike RL, where you have to invest quite a lot to set up your own newspaper.

    However, “having a blog” and “having an audience” are two completely different things. While you have “the right to talk”, the “right to be heard” is something else. More important than that is the form. The usual image quoted here is: “your home is your castle where you’re the overlord”. This means that you can set up the standards you wish on your own home โ€” but not on other people’s homes, who have exactly the same right to set their own standards. In a civil and polite society, we respect other people’s rights to do at their own homes whatever they wish, and fully expect them to respect your wishes as well.

    This is Linden Lab’s own blog. They set the rules. To “get an audience” here, you have to abide by those rules; but on your own blog/forum, you set the rules, and Linden Lab’s employees, when posting there, will abide by your rules instead. This is not limiting in any way, since, thanks to the low cost of the Internet, you have the complete freedom of setting up your own blog/forum with negligible costs โ€” and that is one of the reasons why the Internet is such a fantastic tool: no one is discriminated. Everybody can join it. The entry cost is virtually nil. The audience is the world. You set the rules. What could be better than that? ๐Ÿ™‚

    Now, imposing your rules on other people’s blogs is simply not allowed. If you want a space to rant, complain, and insult others โ€” go and build it yourself. This blog is not the place for it. If you want to complain here, you have to abide by the rules. And they are simple to follow: complain as loud as you wish, but you have to do it in a civil way โ€” which requires talent and skill, and is not for everybody. But โ€” remember, you always have the choice of creating your own space under your own rules! The third most read blog in the SLogosphere works under totally different rules, where bluntness is the norm, and civility is not a requirement to post there. Nevertheless, it has a huge audience.

    Then there is the other issue that Torley put so well, which is the “spiral of happiness”. Bad things happen. People get hurt. They get furious. They need an “escape valve” to deal with frustration.

    Research does not show that venting this frustration by being destructive, insulting others, or behaving childishly in public actually helps. Apparently, it releases some adrenalin in your bloodstream making you “feel good” about it for a bit, but, like any other adrenalin rushes, it quickly fades away, leaving you as miserable and frustrated as before. It has no long-term effects whatsoever โ€” you’ll still feel bad, furious, and frustrated.

    However, no matter how 1960s it might sound, Torley’s “happiness spiral” is, indeed, documented in research as being a much sounder way to deal with negative feelings and frustration (if we had any doubts, we could just look and Torley and see how she positively radiates happiness ๐Ÿ™‚ ). It comes from little things, like finding a single colourful flower erupting from the concrete of the sidewalk on a dark and cloudy day. Noticing the tidbits that make you happy โ€” and share them with others โ€” builds your own positive feelings, one step at the time, and that reinforces your sense of well-being through a mechanism of positive feedback. In fact, our own brains are wired to slowly erase your negative thoughts after a while, but focus on the positive ones (ie. “the good old days” which everybody fondly remembers โ€” they were never as good as we remember them, but as bad โ€” or worse โ€” than the current days. We just forget the bad parts and keep the good ones, and that’s why the past is always golden and bright, and the present seems bleak by comparison).

    Does this mean that we should only post good and happy thoughts? Well, not necessarily. But by doing that in a cheerful manner, we’re actually reinforcing our own mental state towards a positive attitude. This means disregarding what is short-term and nasty, and focusing instead what is long-term and cheerful.

    Consider the usual examples: “Inventory doesn’t open”, “teleports are broken”, “Search doesn’t work as it used to”. What is better in the long term? Insulting the Lindens (and your fellow residents) so that we get an adrenaline rush from “doing the right thing” (and, after the rush, be as miserable as before, because things are still broken…)? Or constructively think about ways to derive pleasure from Second Life while Linden Lab keeps working on the issues that are broken? Well, do you seriously need to have all your Inventory, and be able to teleport everywhere, and search for that lost pose ball store โ€” every waking hour that you’re logged in? Of course the answer is “no” โ€” there are far more things that will give you pleasure and enjoyment during the time these things are addressed (and they always are fixed โ€” they can only take longer than we are willing to wait). This is a positive attitude which will work a lot towards increasing your happiness.

    A business person will even do more than that. Instead of complaining that some things don’t work, they will see that as a market opportunity. So, search is broken again? Ok, let’s start to work on a 3rd party search engine (there are now lots of them around!). I can’t teleport to my favourite clothes shop? Well, perhaps I should start my own clothing business. The poseball script is broken? Perhaps I should write my own (or hire someone to do it for me) and start selling scripts that do not break. The business-minded will address shortcomings on the infrastructure โ€” even if these are temporary โ€” and think how to actually profit from those. That’s the kind of positive thinking that has brought civilization to the very technological 21st century ๐Ÿ™‚

    Of course, not everybody is a business person, and many are simply consumers of entertainment (chatting and buying clothes is entertainment), and if your entertainment โ€” what makes you happy โ€” is removed/broken/inaccessible, you complain. Well, again, a more open minded approach usually deals with this easily enough. If your only source of enjoyment is shopping for clothes, and you can’t do that because Search is broken and teleports don’t work โ€” well, what about adding new sources of entertainment to your list, instead of complaining about the ones that are temporarily down? You might be surprised of what you can find ๐Ÿ™‚ (I’m always surprised myself!)

    Attitude defines directly the way you feel about yourself. Torley is the living example of that. Switch your attitude, and your life suddenly will look much brighter, shinier, and happier. And people with that kind of attitude will always share their happy thoughts with others. However, changing one’s attitude is not easy โ€” it takes a lot of personal effort and the will to change. Most people in the world sadly have no wish and no will to do that; in some cases, professional support can help, but not always. Still, a first step is learning the old saying: “Friends come and go, but enemies accumulate”. Start working on your friends then.

    I wish that everyone would learn Torley’s lesson.

  88. Schizm Neutra says:

    K, I posted my comment at 1:42…I see others that have been ‘approved’ posted at 1:57…what’s the deal? I have no profanity in my comment, it is not overly long, it is not a ‘flame’ nor any other kind of nasty comment…yet it is still not there?

  89. Schizm Neutra says:

    I JUST posted my comment again here, at 2:18…it’s a complaint about how a griefer got into our church and created havoc before we could ‘freeze’ him, etc., and that the ‘submit’ or ‘send’ button at the end of the report on my screen wasn’t visible. Good thing the others there could see theirs and send the report.

    I’m suggesting that the ‘Techies’ MOVE the button for ‘submit’ or ‘send’ UP so we won’t have to worry about it being covered by the bottom toolbar…let’s see if THIS comment gets thru…

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  92. jarael cameron says:

    id like to know why the comments for the billing issues has been closed when the issues have not resolved and so many people still not being able to buy lindens. i have spoke to paypal and they say it a problem on ur end n u are saying its a problem on their end.
    i dont care whose problem it is but i need it sorted, i need to buy lindens as soon as possible or im goin to lose my shop in secondlife.

    failing any response does anyone know of any other trustful place i can buy lindens?

  93. ginseng kyong says:

    I do not see a place to enter in comments for most of the official blogs that are posted, yet I see plenty of userโ€™s comments. This is the first time I have seen a place to enter a comment. It is a bit frustrating to not be able to offer a suggestion to a blog that has been closed after it receives 100 comments or am I unable to find the correct navigation to the area to enter in a comment?

  94. Jayce Altamura says:

    What’s all the beef about closing comments and censoring content? The Chinese do it with Yahoo. Peace of mind and tranquility is a Buddhist ideal we should all strive for. Do you really want to see another picture of the Tianamen square protests? So chill out and enjoy the filtered content. And if someone gets out of line, report them to the authorities. What kind of country do you think we live in anyway?

  95. sailao kawaguichi says:

    Hi all,

    Please help. i have been locked out of SL. my account name is still activate and recognised, but my password is no longer valid and somehow my hotmail account has been changed too. I cannot change my passowrd either. Can anybody help me. Is there a number i can call for help?

    Regards,

    sailao kawaguichi

  96. Moll Dean says:

    Hi Torley ๐Ÿ™‚ I love your videos and uplift blog entries.
    I don’t know what is going on with the blog.secondlife.com… I uploaded 2 comments that are all about very productive suggestions and not the usual arrogant and ironic comments so common. No, no… I think that good idea, brain-storns, information sharing is more valued than seeding bad vibration into our community.
    Even then, my comments stays “awaiting moderation”… (forever?)
    We know Linden Lab is a very yourng company still learning to deal with its huge members list, but it’s customer support is going from bad to worst, day-by-day.
    I have support requests (in support page) that had never been answered in months.
    I worked with costumer support (GMF Assistance in Brazil) and dealt with national and international support request in a volume that you can not image it. We ran and won the ISO 9001 and got the top best assistance company of the South America! The secret? REALLY ASSIST COSTUMERS.
    I am not there anymore, but I would love to help LL if needed.

    Well… hope to get comments aproved to be posted at blog.secondlife.com and to be listened. I would be pretty happy to see some suggestion becoming real :))

    All best regards.

  97. AH says:

    Please either don’t pre-moderate comments or, if you need to do so, please get to them in a very timely manner.

    I’ve had a comment “awaiting moderation” for over four hours.

    I’d rather deal with one of those “prove you’re human” boxes, as annoying as they are, to limit spam on my first comment. You could also have a “report this comment” box for spam or other rule breaking comments, to speed their removal.

    Heck, a Linden employee posted a response while my comment awaited moderation. I’d think he could have taken 2 minutes to approve it?

  98. Torley, I was reading this page because I recently commented on a LL blog and was actually wondering when I would be moderated ๐Ÿ˜‰ and decided since you wrote this there must be value and there is.

    I also wanted to say that we must be kins because I too have seen the face of depression and hit bottom shortly after 9/11 happened, the details are needed here.

    But I got help too, from people and places that I did not expect. With their help I am better and off medication and for the first time in my life I am happy. Happier than I have ever been and like you when I see something that excites me and makes me happy, I like to share it with others. Funny though, not everyone appreciates that excitement or plain old glee at something cool, beautiful or touching.

    Thanks Torley, for understanding that, maybe that is why I enjoy your meetings so very much. You are pure pleasure and a delight.

    We who have seen, touched and breathed the darkness of depression rejoice in life and the beauty that exists all around us. SecondLife is filled with examples of the creative hearts and minds of the many people from all walks of life.

    Rejoice in that beauty and the people that make it and then the lag, along with the other problems the software or network conditions gives us, is just a momentary flicker of disturbance in an otherwise exciting environment of possibilities.

    Remember, in SecondLife the sun always comes up tomorrow.

  99. Aleen Torok says:

    loads of posts are not comment allowed. or get closed quickly. and my comments are NEVER approved. even my helpful ones arnt. whats the point in posting if they arnt approved?

  100. Noisey Lane says:

    Hey! What happened to my comment(s)!! LOL. I found this blog entry after maybe 4 or 5 of my positive, on-topic posts have been ignored. What? Is there a conspiracy against me or can you only post if you’re a citizen of the good ol’ USA? Do I have to be logged in to the website (if so where is that advice? – and I have been most times) As I watch the new blog posts grow often with multiple entries from the same individuals and I am ignored, I can’t help wondering what am I doing wrong?! I’m relatively computer savvy but not in the upper echelons of geekness quite yet and just visiting the support portal is enough to turn me into a wibbly-wobbly jelly mess. I can’t imagine how it must be for people with English as a second language as it’s near impossible for me to find anything there when I just need a quick answer. Asking other resies in-world is way quicker in most cases – but i digress (and run the risk of having another post deleted!) So before my paranoia about being ignored starts to affect my RL, can someone please tell me a good reason why my posts are being ignored. And don’t say they contravene the blog guidelines coz they’re not all as sarcastic as this one and I always try to progress the debate forward in a constructive manner. Currently, all my posts are “waiting, pending moderation” and finally the post count gets to 100 and I’m left out again. I’m starting to develop a complex – just like the support portal. :/

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